I’ve got a customer who has been just getting hammered with break-ins, lock drilling, and theft. There vending machines have been totaled so many times that it’s not cost effective to fix or your replace them. The manager currently pulls all the tokens and money from all the equipment at 5pm before he goes home and they are still destroying the equipment, last weekend they destroyed 4 coin boxes to get the token and quarter out of the coin acceptor. They put in an excellent video system and all they get are great pictures of people in hoodies. They are seriously considering doing away with accepting Quarters and going to credit/debit only, no cash or coins on the property. Has anyone heard of anyone doing this? Does anyone see any major draw backs in doing this?
Going Cashless - No Coins accepted
- Thread starter Randy
- Start date
Jeff_L
Well-known member
PaulLovesJamie
rural 5 bay SS
The only drawback I can think of is the obvious one - losing some cash customers.
I assume the owner has done some analysis regarding current payment patterns ie credit/debit vs coins vs bills vs tokens, so he can forecast how his income is likely to change. And considered how to educate customers to the change.
I'd also be concerned about the vandalism continuing for a while after he changes, crooks arent known to be the best & brightest.
Might want to hire someone to catch the buggers, both before & after he makes the change.
I assume the owner has done some analysis regarding current payment patterns ie credit/debit vs coins vs bills vs tokens, so he can forecast how his income is likely to change. And considered how to educate customers to the change.
I'd also be concerned about the vandalism continuing for a while after he changes, crooks arent known to be the best & brightest.
Might want to hire someone to catch the buggers, both before & after he makes the change.
PaulLovesJamie
rural 5 bay SS
Here's a thought - "credit only after dark" and leave the vaults unlocked and open all night.
DiamondWash
Well-known member
I would be staking out my wash fully armed and put a stop to this sh*t because it seems the police dept is doing such a great job.
mjwalsh
6 bay SS w/laundromat
Randy,
It is just a thought ... but it seems like if a person or group of people could skillfully lay it on the line to what is happening ... to the elected commissioner in charge of police ... there could actually be an all out police effort to stake out & time after time apprehend these criminals. Especially, if it is happening as often as described. The frequency could actually work for the operator & other local operators in terms of getting enough of those criminals off the street ... & also get the word out to others that there is higher risk to the "hoodies" than just the recorded cameras! A good relationship with the local news people could also potentially help to keep the commissioner, police chief, & even the mayor to pay the necessary attention so local small business people are on not continuously on the receiving end of so much hurt.
I know we got hit by an unbelievable episode of theft-vandalism a couple of years ago ... it turned out to be kind of a follow-up neighborhood watch proposition to some extent in our case. I am not convinced that if our 50+ items glass front AMS, the Crane machine, & other items would have been spared if they had been credit card only. A bit better tweaked split second effective alarm alert - & ability to respond quick enough ... along with continuous flow of reasonably considerate other customers seems like a better solution. More enabled partnership with law enforcement & needed flow of customers was one of the arguments when they tried to force the ND car wash operators to charge more (most likely fewer customers) because of the gross receipt tax attempts in our state. I know some will say there is not a correlation between the two issues but I honestly think & feel there is a relationship involved.
Mike Walsh www.kingkoin.com
It is just a thought ... but it seems like if a person or group of people could skillfully lay it on the line to what is happening ... to the elected commissioner in charge of police ... there could actually be an all out police effort to stake out & time after time apprehend these criminals. Especially, if it is happening as often as described. The frequency could actually work for the operator & other local operators in terms of getting enough of those criminals off the street ... & also get the word out to others that there is higher risk to the "hoodies" than just the recorded cameras! A good relationship with the local news people could also potentially help to keep the commissioner, police chief, & even the mayor to pay the necessary attention so local small business people are on not continuously on the receiving end of so much hurt.
I know we got hit by an unbelievable episode of theft-vandalism a couple of years ago ... it turned out to be kind of a follow-up neighborhood watch proposition to some extent in our case. I am not convinced that if our 50+ items glass front AMS, the Crane machine, & other items would have been spared if they had been credit card only. A bit better tweaked split second effective alarm alert - & ability to respond quick enough ... along with continuous flow of reasonably considerate other customers seems like a better solution. More enabled partnership with law enforcement & needed flow of customers was one of the arguments when they tried to force the ND car wash operators to charge more (most likely fewer customers) because of the gross receipt tax attempts in our state. I know some will say there is not a correlation between the two issues but I honestly think & feel there is a relationship involved.
Mike Walsh www.kingkoin.com
lighthousecarwash
Active member
Would be cheaper to hire an armed guard to police the place every night than repair the damage. Some people only respond to the business end of a gun and it would not take long to get the word out that you are not to be messed with.
Reds
Member
I'm with Diamond Wash. I would stake out the wash myself - armed and dangerous. I carry all the time (concealed) due to some incidents that have happened in the area and at the wash.
+1 on conceal carry. I carry especially when collecting $$$ from the wash. I just renewed my license. The Police Chief told me "If there was an incident" its better to be Tried by 12 than carried off by 6....
robert roman
Bob Roman
When I worked in the vending industry, operations risk (i.e. crime) was mitigated early on when solving the location problem for site selection.
Since you can’t fix a bad location, vendors will weigh options before re-locating a machine. What a vendor is willing or unwilling to do is a function of cause and effect and benefit cost.
Causality is income producing property – here, devices that contain cash. Potential effect from vandalism is loss of cash and expense to repair/replace device.
When does situation occur? When there are no figures of authority on property.
Why does situation occur? Individuals other than customers have easy access to devices.
Why didn’t surveillance prevent situation? Camera can’t directly intervene as figure of authority.
Why didn’t no cash on site prevent situation - because criminals are irrational especially those committing situational crimes.
Moreover, going plastic payment only is irrational as not accepting plastic at all, only cash.
So, what would be more effective, paying figure of authority or barrier to control access?
Either would prevent the situation.
Since you can’t fix a bad location, vendors will weigh options before re-locating a machine. What a vendor is willing or unwilling to do is a function of cause and effect and benefit cost.
Causality is income producing property – here, devices that contain cash. Potential effect from vandalism is loss of cash and expense to repair/replace device.
When does situation occur? When there are no figures of authority on property.
Why does situation occur? Individuals other than customers have easy access to devices.
Why didn’t surveillance prevent situation? Camera can’t directly intervene as figure of authority.
Why didn’t no cash on site prevent situation - because criminals are irrational especially those committing situational crimes.
Moreover, going plastic payment only is irrational as not accepting plastic at all, only cash.
So, what would be more effective, paying figure of authority or barrier to control access?
Either would prevent the situation.
chaz
Active member
Not sure i would put any more money in the facility. If possible I would cut my loss, and run.
wash4me
Member
So in the last year how much have the repair costs been? Often this is an emotionally draining experience but when you actually add up the costs of the damage it may not be logical to change much of anything. That being said one idea is an email sent on motion that wakes someone up and they either activate alarms, call police, or call a security company that is nearby and gets paid for arrests.
MEP001
Well-known member
I've often thought we need a company that remotely views the surveillance video. Obviously there couldn't be someone actually watching all the time, but someone connected to multiple locations and alerted via the system's motion detection to make sure it's a customer and not a burglar.
bigleo48
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Mep,
You can hire someone/firm in India to do this. It would be about $10/hr via firm. That person's job would be to monitor the video. Rig alarms that can be operated remotely...I have done this and its easy. I use it from time to time.
I agree with staking out the site and putting and end to this. After a while, it will become known that this place is not worth it. You may be surprised that its coming from the same person or group...so once you weed them out, most of the headache is gone.
I would love to go to credit only. It would make everything so much simpler. However it breaks one of my basic rules which is "do not make it hard for your customers to give you money"
Big
You can hire someone/firm in India to do this. It would be about $10/hr via firm. That person's job would be to monitor the video. Rig alarms that can be operated remotely...I have done this and its easy. I use it from time to time.
I agree with staking out the site and putting and end to this. After a while, it will become known that this place is not worth it. You may be surprised that its coming from the same person or group...so once you weed them out, most of the headache is gone.
I would love to go to credit only. It would make everything so much simpler. However it breaks one of my basic rules which is "do not make it hard for your customers to give you money"
Big
Waxman
Super Moderator
Install Cryptopay and see how it goes. 90+% I'm sure have credit cards, so what's the risk? Just do it.
MEP001
Well-known member
I'd much prefer to not farm out things to foreign countries. Besides, I'm talking about a company dedicated to monitoring car washes with employees trained in what to look for to identify stringing or how to tell if someone is pretending to wash to cover a break-in (I'm remembering a video someone had of three people working together, one using the spray from the wand to conceal the other two popping the meter door open and using a 12V vacuum to suck the quarters out of the vault). With a couple people monitoring a couple dozen or more washes, the cost of the service per car wash owner could be a lot less than $10/hour.
I wouldn't doubt it's just one person doing it, and getting him in jail would stop it.
bigleo48
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I got local quotes for this and it cost prohibitive. India is perfect because of cost and the time difference. I have dealt with overnight guards for years...because its at night, the effectiveness of the monitoring was greatly diminished.
MEP001
Well-known member
I'm talking about someone, possibly one of us operators, starting the service ourselves.
