presoak order for touch free

[briteauto]

I have seen posts for applying the high ph, then the low. I've also seen posts and chemical companies stating to do the opposite. Which is correct? Shouldn't the car be brought to the lowest ph possible before ccp?

If that is the case, shouldn't it be high, then low? Or do they pretty much neutralize and something else has to be used to get to the low ph level on the vehicle surface prior to ccp?

 

[Fatboy769]

Briteauto, I don't know if there is a "correct" way. I think it depends on each car washes location and what road grime your trying to clean. I use a high ph first, followed by a low ph pass which works great for me. My friend uses a low ph first, followed by high ph, works great for him. I use JBS chemicals, he uses Warsaw.

 

[rph9168]

I am not sure that there is a right way. I have seen it work effectively both ways. I think it depends on the brand of chemicals you are using, the dilution ratios and your equipment. You probably need to experiment with your set up to see what works best for you.

Some operators switch according to seasons. They apply the high pH first during bug seasons to soften the bugs and the low pH first during normal conditions. If you are having drying issues I would recommend the low pH second to assist drying as you suggest.

 

[Waxman]

Somer operators also use 2 high ph passes. I am experimenting with this now.

 

[briteauto]

Thanks for the replies - this is helpful.

Somer operators also use 2 high ph passes. I am experimenting with this now.

Waxman, are you using two different products, both alkaline, or the same one twice?

Also - it seems as though operators who use one step use a high ph. Are there any one-step low ph products? Or maybe two low ph passes? I have not hear of this, but does it exist?

I have been operating friction for years, and just took over a touchless wash - it is a learning curve. Currently using Lustra products, but am not tied to them in any way.

 

[Waxman]

I use the same product twice, hi ph.

I also experimented with hi ph first, pretty strong, then a low ph very lightly applied second pass to neutralize. Got good results that way, but went through too much product (hi ph).

 

[Kurt]

I've done a lot of playing around with chemicals over the last couple of years. Here's a little of what I have learned:

1. For MY area (ie: dirt types in my area) LOW-HIGH has ALWAYS worked better no matter what the chemical salesman tells you. You need to experiment for your conditions. This may also change at certain times of the year, but I leave it this way always now.

2. You want the second pass to be strong enough to swing the pH past neutral. In my case, it goes way high, which isn't that great for drying, but I take care of that with CCP. Rinsing well pretty much gets you at least to neutral pH anyways.

3. Don't ever trust labels/ starting point titrations, especially if someone is quoting you per car costs. You MUST do your own volume calculations to figure out what you are paying per car.

4. Titration starting points are just that- start there, and then increase concentration until you are getting clean cars. I watch HUNDREDS of cars before deciding if things are good. Touchless can sometimes be hard to judge since you can never clean all cars 100%, and everyone's idea of "clean" is different.

5. If you are going to do touchless right, you have to use soft and hot water. You can also get some better results at certain times of the year by increasing your soaking time. I do 10 seconds for easy times, 15 when it gets tough.

Kurt