Problem of water constantly running in ss bays.

[slash007]

I purchased a car wash a couple of months ago and have been chasing down a problem with water continuously running in my self serve bays ever since. Water constantly drips in 4 out of my 5 bays. If you squeeze the trigger it comes out at a steady stream. My first inclination was that it was a defective solenoid on the weep system, but after replacing the internal parts and then finally the whole thing, I ruled that out. I have spent hours trying different things and have so far only figured out that it is siphonage. I have a Jim Coleman Super Saver tank and if I hold the ss wands higher than the tank, then the flow of water stops. I also know that if I disconnect the water line anyplace between the pump and wand air is introduced and the siphonage stops. What I don't know is what I can do to fix it. I have spoken to many experienced car wash repair specialists with no luck and was hoping that someone here might be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[lighthousecarwash]

I have a few bays that do the same thing. I watch my bay cameras from home all night when I'm working and see the "water spot" on the concrete running into the drains. Drives me nuts.

Lighthouse.

 

[slash007]

Same here, I installed a camera in each bay and seeing that water spot going to the drain drives me crazy. Any idea what might cause the water to constantly run?

 

[Jim L.]

This was covered years ago here on the Forum. All you need to do is install a suction breaker higher than the holding tank. Add a check valve to the manifold above each bay which will let air when all functions are off.

 

[MEP001]

It's not an unusual problem with Coleman equipment because the hot water tank is above the wands. Ideally there should be enough resistance from the pump's valves to prevent siphoning to the bays, but the goofy way they plumb the systems lets the siphon happen.

 

[slash007]

This was covered years ago here on the Forum. All you need to do is install a suction breaker higher than the holding tank. Add a check valve to the manifold above each bay which will let air when all functions are off.

Thanks for the reply. I actually just spoke to someone this morning that advised me the same thing (add a vacuum breaker) The only thing that he wasn't sure of was the location. We thought about adding it in the attic above each bay, right on the line that attaches to the boom, but he wasn't sure if it would be able to handle that much pressure. Is there a certain vacuum breaker that i should use? Thanks.

 

[I.B. Washincars]

Just a cheap check valve will work just fine. A 1/4 X 1/4 Flow brand valve with one end open to atmosphere will do the trick.

 

[slash007]

Just a cheap check valve will work just fine. A 1/4 X 1/4 Flow brand valve with one end open to atmosphere will do the trick.

I found a vacuum breaker that I was going to try, but my concern is that it is only rated at 200psi. If I install these in the attic in order to have them higher than the tank water level, wouldn't the pressure be much higher, say 1000psi that the pump puts out? Or can I install them under the tank on the line that goes to the pump? Thanks.

 

[DiamondWash]

Check valve idea is smarter, 1000psi vs a 200psi vacuum breaker you will see more then a few drip in the bay if that breaks

 

[slash007]

Check valve idea is smarter, 1000psi vs a 200psi vacuum breaker you will see more then a few drip in the bay if that breaks

That's what I figured, but maybe I'm not visualizing the check valve idea correctly. Is there a different type of check valve that I need to use that will let air in? The only check valves that I am familiar with are the ones that are installed in other parts of the car wash. Is there a type that lets in air after the pressure stops? If so, if someone could give me a link to an example I would be extremely greateful. Thanks.

 

[DiamondWash]

I will post a couple pictures

 

[I.B. Washincars]

Find the high point in the plumbing, install a tee, screw a high pressure check valve into the tee, pointing up, open to atmosphere. The flow direction should be from atmosphere, in. The valve will check every time the line is pressurized and open every time pressure is absent. It's that easy.

 

[MEP001]

If I.B.'s description wasn't enough, look at the manifold you have up there now and disconnect one of the tubing lines going to a check valve. There's your siphon breaker - just add another one.

 

[slash007]

Find the high point in the plumbing, install a tee, screw a high pressure check valve into the tee, pointing up, open to atmosphere. The flow direction should be from atmosphere, in. The valve will check every time the line is pressurized and open every time pressure is absent. It's that easy.

No I see it Thanks for the clarification. My highest point is in the attic, so I will just install a tee right into the manifold and then add a check valve pointing up. I will probably install it in the trough. If not, I might tee right where the high pressure hose attaches to the boom swivel if I feel it is higher. Installing the check valve in the trough pointing up shouldn't be a problem, correct?

 

[slash007]

I finally had time today to install check valves in all bays and my problem that I spent countless hours on is now fixed. I wanted to thank everyone that chimed in and got me going in the right direction. It is really appreciated. Now on to my other problems that I can't figure out

 

[Jimmy Buffett]

Diamond I would still love to see a picture if you have one. I'm not as smart as these other guys but I am having the same problem.

 

[DiamondWash]

Getting the picture now

 

[DiamondWash]

I'm guilty of not having a hi pressure check valve myself as you see in the picture

 

[slash007]

I added a check valve to every bay and that fixed my problem of water constantly running, but now I have a new problem. Whenever the weep system kicks on, water runs out of the top of the check valve. It seems that the low pressure is not enough for it to hold the check. When I have someone using the bay using high pressure, they work great and no leaks at all. I only have the problem when the weep is on. One bay seems to be worse then the others. I tried changing the check valve in that bay thinking it was defective, but it still has the same problem. I ended up using this valve from Kleen Rite:

http://www.kleen-ritecorp.com/p-1736-kleen-rite-check-valves-3000psi-38-fxf-brass.aspx

Could the check valve be the problem? It does say less than 1 psi cracking pressure, so I'm not sure if a different model/brand would make a difference. Thoughts?

Thanks.

 

[Jim L.]

Periodically the same thing happens to one of my bays. I disassemble the check valve and stretch the spring till it is 50% to 100% longer than original. Some times I have to do it twice to make it seal under low pressure. I’ve never had one fail to open because I stretched to spring too much.