When a supplier becomes the competition

[JustClean]

How would other 'professional owners' in addition to the many serious issues being addressed (see prev. reply #50) feel if this new wash in question was advertising 'falsely' on a large billboard directly across the street from their business???

1. I would talk to them and ask to remove false advertising.
2. If that doesn't help I would get legal advice.
3. I would consider building a high ranking website with something like: "Thinking of buying equipment from XYZ? - Ask a current owner first!!"

 

[mac]

altcw555 that's a good point. It's adding insult to injury as they say. Rather than get lawyers involved or starting websites, I suggest guerilla tactics. For instance I always carry a few bags of Sakcrete around in my van. Sometimes one will fall over and break. It makes quite a mess. I would love to have a free vac close by to clean it up.

 

[jfmoran]

Priceless

altcw555 that's a good point. It's adding insult to injury as they say. Rather than get lawyers involved or starting websites, I suggest guerilla tactics. For instance I always carry a few bags of Sakcrete around in my van. Sometimes one will fall over and break. It makes quite a mess. I would love to have a free vac close by to clean it up.

Mac,

You got to be kidding. You come on here and impugn Sonny's (without actually saying their name) and then you make this statement above, you clearly are an upstanding ethical guy.

John Moran

 

[mac]

Well thank you. I'll take any compliments I can get. Just make sure you spell my name right.

 

[JMMUSTANG]

This happens in all indusrties.
My first business was a gift shop in a major mall owned by a large mall operator in the country.
Guess what, they also owned a large chain of gift stores. They built 2 of them in the mall just down from my store.
I survived but could have been a lot more profitable without them.
Shoe mfgs. that not only mfg. shoes but own retail shoe stores competing against stores that buy their shoes wholesale from them.
Oil companies own gas station with car washes next door or close by an owner operator. Happen to me too. My wash/gas is still operating after 31 yrs.
Dan Hanna, a man I looked up to and helped me immensely back in the 70's, and the Sherman guys owned many washes in their lifetime.
With their experiences at the washes look what they have done for our industry.
I'm not happy about Sonny's, if they do own all or part of this wash, but I do believe that they have also done a lot of good for our industry.
I agree it's not great, right or whatever you want to call it but it's nothing new in or industry or others.

 

[MEP001]

Mac,

You got to be kidding. You come on here and impugn Sonny's (without actually saying their name) and then you make this statement above, you clearly are an upstanding ethical guy.

This isn't the first remark from mac regarding his questionable ethics.

http://forum.autocareforum.net/showthread.php?t=1297

 

[stevie g]

This isn't the first remark from mac regarding his questionable ethics.

http://forum.autocareforum.net/showthread.php?t=1297

There's a distinct difference between doing what mac suggested with the concrete and vacs versus altering a vending setup that invariably harms a would-be-thief.

The former is unethical, the latter not so much. Thieves get what they deserve.

Oh, and Proctor and Gamble is doing something very similar here in Cincinnati with it's Mr Clean-branded washes. For now they are set up as test locations for the "uber-deluxe" niche of our market, but if this takes off, they want to be the first national chain. And P&G has the pockets to pull it off.

 

[MEP001]

There's a distinct difference between doing what mac suggested with the concrete and vacs versus altering a vending setup that invariably harms a would-be-thief.

In both cases he's basically attacking someone he feels has done wrong, making himself a hypocrite.

 

[mac]

Well I have never claimed to be the arbriter of final judgement. What I find amusing is that some have questioned my morals or ethics. That's fine with me. It's always good to question authority. But those people have not addressed my original point, that of some having a distinct advantage over others. It seems aparent from the postings that most frown on this sort of thing. I went and talked to the owner who had the misleading billboard right across from his wash. For those of you wishing to call me whatever, imagine if you had just spent somewhere close to $140,000 on a new automatic, only to see this. How would you react? Think about that before you post a response. I have simply reached that point in life that when I see something that I don't like, I go to bare knuckle discussions and guerilla tactics. You are free to react as you wish. I have seen the futility of lawyers, letter writing campaigns, and other similar responses. You can judge the relativety of any subject on this site by the number of responses. We're close to 70 now. This must have hit a nerve.

 

[RykoPro]

Purposely putting concrete in someone's vac is a cowards way of handling matters. Questioning your ethics has nothing to do with questioning authority! The only thing you seem to be an authority on is sneaky low handed tricks.

 

[Axxlrod]

Well I have never claimed to be the arbriter of final judgement. What I find amusing is that some have questioned my morals or ethics. That's fine with me. It's always good to question authority. But those people have not addressed my original point, that of some having a distinct advantage over others. It seems aparent from the postings that most frown on this sort of thing. I went and talked to the owner who had the misleading billboard right across from his wash. For those of you wishing to call me whatever, imagine if you had just spent somewhere close to $140,000 on a new automatic, only to see this. How would you react? Think about that before you post a response. I have simply reached that point in life that when I see something that I don't like, I go to bare knuckle discussions and guerilla tactics. You are free to react as you wish. I have seen the futility of lawyers, letter writing campaigns, and other similar responses. You can judge the relativety of any subject on this site by the number of responses. We're close to 70 now. This must have hit a nerve.

Please tell us what this "misleading billboard" says.

 

[BayWatch]

What's the record for # of posts for one thread?

 

[I.B. Washincars]

This one ain't even in the playoffs. We had one on the old forum that went over 400.

 

[mac]

The billboard in question states basically, $3.00 wash and free vacs. The vacs however are not free unless you buy the wash. The billboard doesn't say that though. So imagine you are a customer looking only to vac out the car. As you are ready to pull in you see the ad and go there. This discussion has some interesting opinions on my character. Too bad. Get over it for those bothered by it. Tell me please how my doing something perfectly legal, vacuuming my car to get the dirt out, is bad. The sign at the vacs has only one prohibition for the users. It asks not to vacuum liquids. Doesn't say anything else. So if I did do this, I am perfectly legal, but frowned upon by some of you. Well, that is the whole point of this subject. The person who put the wash and billboard up, someone related or involved with Sonny's, did nothing illegal, yet many here frowned upon it. If that is your standard for business operations, don't be surprised if others adopt those same standards. BTW in some countries thiefs that are caught have their hands cut off. You want to steal from me , expect a lot of pain.

 

[MEP001]

The billboard in question states basically, $3.00 wash and free vacs.

Whether or not it's ethical, it's perfectly legal. Nextel's salesmen would advertise their phones with "No roaming and no long distance charges". The "and" separator made it technically clear that there is no roaming service at all, which is the case with Nextel, but they don't bother to volunteer that information.

Tell me please how my doing something perfectly legal, vacuuming my car to get the dirt out, is bad.

To do this with malice aforethought (re: intentionally vacuuming something you know and have even stated will ruin their equipment) is both illegal and unethical.

 

[altcw555]

We need to clarify that the 'AND' is not any part of this billboard. Only 'FREE VACUUMS' in large reverse print with NO MENTION of having to purchase a wash. (A photo of the billboard should be getting posted soon) Not only is that 'false and/or misleading' advertising but again is just one of the many reasons a lot of these replys would be different if you were the owner of a wash now doing the competing or having to compete with in the future!

 

[Greg Pack]

Signage on the vac canopy indicating Free Vacuums is the express template. You can push the issue, an they can put up a disclaimer in tiny words under it that say "with any wash purchase", or worse yet, they actually say "You know, you're right. Let's open them up and make them free to everyone". Several operators already do that. If you get to the panhandle- Look at Wash N Joe's (IBA/SS) in Destin- Free vacs for one and all-no purchase necessary.

I feel for the guy that just spent 140K on the new auto. But any IBA/SS operator that is in potential expresses market has to learn to deal with them. From a customer's perspective, they are generally a better value than IBA/SS. Especially now that the Real Estate equity money train has come to a stop. People are looking for value. It's hard to beat $3 and free vacuum.

 

[RykoPro]

Mac wrote:BTW in some countries thiefs that are caught have their hands cut off. You want to steal from me , expect a lot of pain.

I believe in direct confrontation and not sneaking around using p##sy tactics. Maybe you should move to another country, as hand removal is not the punishment for stealing in this country. Revenge and vigilantism are not something to be proud of! I want to look someone in the eye when settling issues.

 

[rph9168]

I am not so sure that the Free Vacuum issue is necessarily false advertisement. I have seen similar signs throughout the country and I would guess an extremely small amount of people would think that they could vacuum their vehicle without purchasing a wash. It sounds like a bit of nit picking to me along with some sour grapes. Although I think it is not the best business decision for a manufacturer to become a competitor I am not so sure that this is even the case here. Simply because an employee of the manufacturer is involved doesn't mean they got anything more than a break on their equipment.

By the way, several years back Turtle Wax bought and built tunnel washes in Chicago. I bet the amount of chemical business they lost in that town did not equal the revenue from their washes. Bad business move.

 

[RykoPro]

I am not so sure that the Free Vacuum issue is necessarily false advertisement. I have seen similar signs throughout the country and I would guess an extremely small amount of people would think that they could vacuum their vehicle without purchasing a wash. It sounds like a bit of nit picking to me along with some sour grapes. Although I think it is not the best business decision for a manufacturer to become a competitor I am not so sure that this is even the case here. Simply because an employee of the manufacturer is involved doesn't mean they got anything more than a break on their equipment.

By the way, several years back Turtle Wax bought and built tunnel washes in Chicago. I bet the amount of chemical business they lost in that town did not equal the revenue from their washes. Bad business move.

I have to agree with RPH on this issue!