New Petit install & having HELL!! Need some help

[soonermajic]

Just curious …. Why don’t you go with Dencar? With the amount of money invested it is by far and beyond the superior teller out there

Dencar told me in the South, the unit gets too hot, & would need an A.C.!
Also, i am friends w/ a tunnel manager. Was visiting his site& in 20 minutes saw a red car & Silver truck go thru 3x each!!! His respinse, it's not my $$ & it's UNLIMITED. If i get 8--10 customers like that, my site is ruined. May, or may not happen, but it dang sure isn't happening w/out my permission (ie: im not dping unlimited right now).
I didn't wanna go an extra half mil, on doubling entire site, to add a 2nd Petit & go unlimited.
If i get over 60--70cpd, i may add a 2nd bay. But Im going to give it a while. I am seriously considering doing an App, Touch4Wash, & maybe go "buy 5--10 washes, get 1 free".
Lots of questions & areas to consider...

 

[HeyVern]

Dencar told me in the South, the unit gets too hot, & would need an A.C.!
Also, i am friends w/ a tunnel manager. Was visiting his site& in 20 minutes saw a red car & Silver truck go thru 3x each!!! His respinse, it's not my $$ & it's UNLIMITED. If i get 8--10 customers like that, my site is ruined. May, or may not happen, but it dang sure isn't happening w/out my permission (ie: im not dping unlimited right now).
I didn't wanna go an extra half mil, on doubling entire site, to add a 2nd Petit & go unlimited.
If i get over 60--70cpd, i may add a 2nd bay. But Im going to give it a while. I am seriously considering doing an App, Touch4Wash, & maybe go "buy 5--10 washes, get 1 free".
Lots of questions & areas to consider...

Memberships with Dencar aren't unlimited and with the Petit you're not going to need rewashes.

 

[OurTown]

Memberships with Dencar aren't unlimited and with the Petit you're not going to need rewashes.

Yes you can limit them to whatever you want which is nice. We went to a Petit the other day that has been open about two months now and it was awful. I know I'm going to sound like "one of those" Google reviewers but it really was dirtier afterwards. It looked like it didn't clean well, applied too much protectant and then didn't rinse well. We went there a month or so earlier and it was sorta okay but I got the bottom package then. It is sad it is being ran that way because it looks like a very impressive machine.

 

[HeyVern]

Yes you can limit them to whatever you want which is nice. We went to a Petit the other day that has been open about two months now and it was awful. I know I'm going to sound like "one of those" Google reviewers but it really was dirtier afterwards. It looked like it didn't clean well, applied too much protectant and then didn't rinse well. We went there a month or so earlier and it was sorta okay but I got the bottom package then. It is sad it is being ran that way because it looks like a very impressive machine.

it's like any other machine, you have to have your chemicals and passes set up right. I had a few come out that weren't clean about a week ago, for some reason, my titrations had changed.

 

[Carwashclubber]

Just curious …. Why don’t you go with Dencar? With the amount of money invested it is by far and beyond the superior teller out there

Wow. naked shilling for Ron&Phil? Be sure to also mention: most expensive, huge monthly fee, slow tech support, poor components quality.

 

[AnalyticWash]

most expensive, huge monthly fee, slow tech support, poor components quality.

This could be used to describe any of the solutions on the market. I priced them all at the last car wash show. Its all the same BS. Just pick the company that seems the least evil...

 

[washnshine]

Dencar told me in the South, the unit gets too hot, & would need an A.C.!
Also, i am friends w/ a tunnel manager. Was visiting his site& in 20 minutes saw a red car & Silver truck go thru 3x each!!! His respinse, it's not my $$ & it's UNLIMITED. If i get 8--10 customers like that, my site is ruined. May, or may not happen, but it dang sure isn't happening w/out my permission (ie: im not dping unlimited right now).
I didn't wanna go an extra half mil, on doubling entire site, to add a 2nd Petit & go unlimited.
If i get over 60--70cpd, i may add a 2nd bay. But Im going to give it a while. I am seriously considering doing an App, Touch4Wash, & maybe go "buy 5--10 washes, get 1 free".
Lots of questions & areas to consider...

Those rewash numbers are not the norm, coach. They must have something set up terribly wrong. I am not unlimited, but I have not had a rewash yet this calendar year - that’s right my last one was in December 2022!

 

[OurTown]

Wow. naked shilling for Ron&Phil? Be sure to also mention: most expensive, huge monthly fee, slow tech support, poor components quality.

You clearly have not checked out ICS. The prices are laughable and I know two owners that have lots of recurring issues with them. We were quoted just under $100K for a fully optioned pay station from ICS. Crack smokers.

 

[soonermajic]

Those rewash numbers are not the norm, coach. They must have something set up terribly wrong. I am not unlimited, but I have not had a rewash yet this calendar year - that’s right my last one was in December 2022!

They're not rewashing cause their cars were dirty. They're rewashing CAUSE THEY CAN (IE:UNLIMITED).

 

[washnshine]

They're not rewashing cause their cars were dirty. They're rewashing CAUSE THEY CAN (IE:UNLIMITED).

Unbelievable!

 

[Car_Wash_Guy]

Wow. naked shilling for Ron&Phil? Be sure to also mention: most expensive, huge monthly fee, slow tech support, poor components quality.

I have absolutely no affiliation with them other than being a satisfied customer. I own 4 of them. Sure, like anything electronic and technical there have been minor issues that pop up occasionally but the guys over there have been a delight to work with compared to other companies customer service I've experienced.

Going dual Petit with the Dancers has absolutely transformed my site. I'll hit 60k cars in my Petits this year.

My experience has been 180* opposite of what you are stating and many other operators would state the same.

YMMV

 

[Carwashclubber]

Also a huge fan of Tom Petit's gear....never thought to hire dancers for my sites. Might lose my soccer mom customers. We'll disagree on the rest, and plenty of unhappy folks choose to remain silent for fear of retribution.

 

[Axxlrod]

I have absolutely no affiliation with them other than being a satisfied customer. I own 4 of them. Sure, like anything electronic and technical there have been minor issues that pop up occasionally but the guys over there have been a delight to work with compared to other companies customer service I've experienced.

Going dual Petit with the Dancers has absolutely transformed my site. I'll hit 60k cars in my Petits this year.

My experience has been 180* opposite of what you are stating and many other operators would state the same.

YMMV

What are dancers?

 

[tylerwash]

I'm having the exact same problem with my ACW4: "car wash in use" happens randomly throughout the day or every few days. We have to power off the control panel and the ACW to clear the error. If nobody on site to reset it, the bay is dead and no customer can use it.

My distributor has been talking to Petit and Hamilton without a resolution. If we reset the control panel frequently, I'm afraid it'll damage the CPU.

I'm not ready to install the HTK for this location because I don't have a great experience with it.

Any help you can give would be greatly appreciated.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I'm having the exact same problem with my ACW4: "car wash in use" happens randomly throughout the day or every few days. We have to power off the control panel and the ACW to clear the error. If nobody on site to reset it, the bay is dead and no customer can use it.

My distributor has been talking to Petit and Hamilton without a resolution. If we reset the control panel frequently, I'm afraid it'll damage the CPU.

I'm not ready to install the HTK for this location because I don't have a great experience with it.

Any help you can give would be greatly appreciated.

We have several ACW4/5’s and have had the same issue over the years. I personally think there is some type of glitch with the controllers as they have been hooked up to various automatic types and they all exhibited the same problem occasionally.

The problem is that the ACW missed, for whatever reason, the inhibit pulse at the end of a wash. Then when the next customer pays, their wash is ‘stacked’ or held because the ACW thinks there is a car in the bay and is waiting for the pulse. Maybe yours is a different problem if you have to actually reboot the ACW to clear it? Try firing the inhibit circuit next time, I’ll bet it loads a wash and is good to go again.

I built a timer circuit to automatically reset it when this would happen. When the ACW is waiting for the inhibit pulse and someone else pays for a wash, it drops out the power from the 24v transformer on the door to the coin mechs to disable them and goes into ‘car wash in use, please wait’ mode. I used the power dropping out to start my timer. My longest wash was about 5 minutes but could take longer if they didn’t exit right away etc. So I set the timer for 10 minutes. Once 10 minutes elapsed, it fired a single shot timer that cycled the inhibit relay which would release the stacked wash. If the customer was still there they would get their wash. If they had driven away then the wash would time out and reset. If you wanted to, you could add a resettable counter to the single shot relay to monitor how often the issue is happening. There are lots of tweaks you can do depending on your setup but this will essentially band aid the problem.

 

[Roz]

We have several ACW4/5’s and have had the same issue over the years. I personally think there is some type of glitch with the controllers as they have been hooked up to various automatic types and they all exhibited the same problem occasionally.

The problem is that the ACW missed, for whatever reason, the inhibit pulse at the end of a wash. Then when the next customer pays, their wash is ‘stacked’ or held because the ACW thinks there is a car in the bay and is waiting for the pulse. Maybe yours is a different problem if you have to actually reboot the ACW to clear it? Try firing the inhibit circuit next time, I’ll bet it loads a wash and is good to go again.

I built a timer circuit to automatically reset it when this would happen. When the ACW is waiting for the inhibit pulse and someone else pays for a wash, it drops out the power from the 24v transformer on the door to the coin mechs to disable them and goes into ‘car wash in use, please wait’ mode. I used the power dropping out to start my timer. My longest wash was about 5 minutes but could take longer if they didn’t exit right away etc. So I set the timer for 10 minutes. Once 10 minutes elapsed, it fired a single shot timer that cycled the inhibit relay which would release the stacked wash. If the customer was still there they would get their wash. If they had driven away then the wash would time out and reset. If you wanted to, you could add a resettable counter to the single shot relay to monitor how often the issue is happening. There are lots of tweaks you can do depending on your setup but this will essentially band aid the problem.

When the wash in use error happens on our Goldline and the customer waiting for their wash calls me I can fix the issue by manually triggering a wash (remotely or onsite). That seems to help the customer who has paid but not gotten their wash and get the GL back into proper sync.

 

[tylerwash]

We have several ACW4/5’s and have had the same issue over the years. I personally think there is some type of glitch with the controllers as they have been hooked up to various automatic types and they all exhibited the same problem occasionally.

The problem is that the ACW missed, for whatever reason, the inhibit pulse at the end of a wash. Then when the next customer pays, their wash is ‘stacked’ or held because the ACW thinks there is a car in the bay and is waiting for the pulse. Maybe yours is a different problem if you have to actually reboot the ACW to clear it? Try firing the inhibit circuit next time, I’ll bet it loads a wash and is good to go again.

I built a timer circuit to automatically reset it when this would happen. When the ACW is waiting for the inhibit pulse and someone else pays for a wash, it drops out the power from the 24v transformer on the door to the coin mechs to disable them and goes into ‘car wash in use, please wait’ mode. I used the power dropping out to start my timer. My longest wash was about 5 minutes but could take longer if they didn’t exit right away etc. So I set the timer for 10 minutes. Once 10 minutes elapsed, it fired a single shot timer that cycled the inhibit relay which would release the stacked wash. If the customer was still there they would get their wash. If they had driven away then the wash would time out and reset. If you wanted to, you could add a resettable counter to the single shot relay to monitor how often the issue is happening. There are lots of tweaks you can do depending on your setup but this will essentially band aid the problem.

Thank you for all your inputs GoBuckeyes. They're very helpful!

You're correct. Before installing the Petit, we ran the D&S i5000. The "car wash in use" error happened occasionally. I would say it only happened every 3 to 6 months but not as frequently as now! We had to power off the control panel then it cleared the signal. When this happened, the red light went off, and the customer knew the bay is out of service. And he wouldn't proceed to the payment.

With the New Petit/ACW 4, there's no way for a customer to know if the bay is OK or not because the instruction light is stuck at "select wash". It will keep charging the customer without giving a wash. So, when this happens at night when unattended, you can't imagine how many refunds you will have to process the next day.

Just like what you suggested, my distributor has been thinking to use a timer circuit to automatically reset it too. I was wondering if erasing all the memories of the ACW and reprogramming it again is going to help because there's no way you can buy a brand new ACW 4/5 controller now.

 

[Randy]

What is the voltage of the CI signal on the Petit? Did your distributor change the CI relay? Do you have the correct voltage relay in the CI position? Watch your CI relay when a car leaves the bay to make sure the CI signal is actually coming back to the ACW. What is the vend duration in the controller?

 

[GoBuckeyes]

With the New Petit/ACW 4, there's no way for a customer to know if the bay is OK or not because the instruction light is stuck at "select wash". It will keep charging the customer without giving a wash. So, when this happens at night when unattended, you can't imagine how many refunds you will have to process the next day.

Hold on a minute. Something else is wrong or something is not wired properly. The ACW4 is pretty simply. It is only capable of stacking and holding one wash. How are multiple people losing money? There are basically three states the ACW has:

1) Waiting to take payment. When it does it will send the wash to the Petit.

2) Waiting to take payment and waiting on a CI input for the last wash it sent to the Petit so it knows the wash is ready. In this case, the ACW will hold the paid wash and display "please wait, car wash in use" indefinitely until the CI signal is received. Once it is received, it will release the wash to the Petit. The ACW will not take anymore payments in this state, the coin mechs and validator are disabled.

3) The last state is where the ACW CI signal is constantly on. At first the display will say "Car Wash Busy", then after 10 minutes the display will change to "Car Wash Closed". Obviously in this state, the ACW will not take any payments.

(This is using the CI circuit in 'Passive' mode meaning the normal state of the relay is deenergized. To signal the input the relay has to have power applied. If you were using it in 'Active' mode the relay is energized all the time and to send the input signal, the power to the relay has to be dropped out.)


Only one person should be able to lose money...the person that is left sitting there indefinitely waiting for their wash. If they end up driving away and someone else pulls up the ACW won't accept any payment.

 

[Roz]

Hold on a minute. Something else is wrong or something is not wired properly. The ACW4 is pretty simply. It is only capable of stacking and holding one wash. How are multiple people losing money? There are basically three states the ACW has:

1) Waiting to take payment. When it does it will send the wash to the Petit.

2) Waiting to take payment and waiting on a CI input for the last wash it sent to the Petit so it knows the wash is ready. In this case, the ACW will hold the paid wash and display "please wait, car wash in use" indefinitely until the CI signal is received. Once it is received, it will release the wash to the Petit. The ACW will not take anymore payments in this state, the coin mechs and validator are disabled.

3) The last state is where the ACW CI signal is constantly on. At first the display will say "Car Wash Busy", then after 10 minutes the display will change to "Car Wash Closed". Obviously in this state, the ACW will not take any payments.

(This is using the CI circuit in 'Passive' mode meaning the normal state of the relay is deenergized. To signal the input the relay has to have power applied. If you were using it in 'Active' mode the relay is energized all the time and to send the input signal, the power to the relay has to be dropped out.)


Only one person should be able to lose money...the person that is left sitting there indefinitely waiting for their wash. If they end up driving away and someone else pulls up the ACW won't accept any payment.

Have you tried to the two polling states active and passive which tell the Paystation what type of signal to look for? There is a toggle switch.

When we have a hiccup (maybe once a month or two) no one loses money or their wash, we just need to trigger the wash to undo the hold at the Paystation. You cannot have more than one car queued up and waiting.

My guess for our situation is the issue arises when one of two customers is in the wash such that the wash does not finish normally.
A. Customer leaves early before the wash package is complete so the WW equipment goes thru the auto home process.
B. Customer sits inside the bay on their cell phone ignoring the direction to drive thru the dryers and confuses the WW equipment to think a car is stuck in the bay.

we get some nutty customers now and then. We now know to issue a wash remotely and things return to normal.

I am not fan of always rebooting equipment to solve a problem however someone in a forum posted a link to a power strip that can be controlled remotely via cell service. It looked cool.