Best Pre-Soaks out there?

[slash007]

When swapping out Tire cleaner for Tri-Foam, people loved it! I never had a complaint about not having "Tire Cleaner". I believe people who used it on a regular basis knew they were the same. Another thing to consider, CB80 advised me to move the PS off the HP gun and put it on a foam gun and separate boom. So I combined Tri-foam and PS on the same foam gun/boom....Now PS foams better than before. No more HP check valves for PS and no more PS weep shutoff solenoids. I love it and so do the customers!

AS for measuring product???? I use Dwyer flow meters! No measuring cups and stop watches or car counts used here!

Hmmm. Very interesting. If you could provide a couple of pictures whenever you have time, it would be appreciated. Do you have air going to your pre-soak as well?

Thanks.

 

[Waxman]

i offer exactly what RR suggests except i also have 3 color foam (least used function).

I make the HP soap come out like milk, the foamy brush like shaving cream and the wax like green milk.

recently raised startup cost to $3.

customers like it.

 

[2Biz]

Hmmm. Very interesting. If you could provide a couple of pictures whenever you have time, it would be appreciated. Do you have air going to your pre-soak as well?

Thanks.

Can you be more specific? What do you need a picture of? My foam gun is a typical foam gun on a swing away boom with curley hose...Yes, I run air with PS but also use the same foam generator as tri foam. The foam generators are above each bay. I have 4 inputs to the foam generators and 1 output to the bay. Inputs are, Tri-foam, Pre-Soak, Windshield washer fluid, and 1 air input. The WWF is for winterizing...

My original pre-soak came out the high pressure gun. By moving it to the foam gun, I was able to eliminate all the High Pressure CV's (12 in total) that were needed to keep from back feeding HP into the PS lines. When running PS through the HP gun, most weep systems have solenoids that turn off the weep when PS is selected to keep from diluting it further. Now that PS is on the foam gun, the weep shutoff solenoids are not needed. 4 more problematic parts out of the mix! You still have to have the "Main" solenoid that controls weep, just to clarify. Let me know what pictures you need?

 

[2Biz]

Slash007 described my Wash exactly.

2Biz, you make some interesting points, however....that is over my head. I JUST STARTED in the biz, & feel like I'm trying to learn Chinese arithmetic from some of you guys. lol

Soonermajic,

Some abbreviations we use here sometime...Maybe this will help.

SFR-Spot Free Rinse
HP-High Pressure
LP-Low Pressure
FB-Foam Brush
TF-Tri Foam
PS-Pre Soak
CW-Car Wash

I gave a more detailed description of how I changed my PS in previous post. Let me know if there is something you don't understand. I'll try to be more specific.

 

[cantbreak80]

You forgot to mention:
SS = Stainless Steel or Secret Sauce (depending on what we’re talking about)
WM = WeepMiser
CV = Check Valve
BFP = Back Flow Preventer
PRV = Pressure Relief Valve
PE = Polyethylene tubing
CC = Credit Card
$1c = Dollar Coin
BC = Bill Changer
GFV = Glass Front Vendor
DSV = Drop Shelf Vendor
MS = Motor Starter
VFD = Variable Frequency Drive
PLC = Programmable Logic Controller
PLR = Programmable Logic Relay
PTC = Push-to-Connect
IHNC = I Have No Clue
BIY = Babe in Yoga Pants (or, some other skin tight/skimpy attire)
ISCP = I See Crazy People (customers washing during rain, snow or extreme cold)
CFS = Can’t Fix Stupid
WTF = no explanation needed
NFB = Next Foam Brush
CONSULTANT = Someone who looks at your wristwatch and tells you what time it is.

And, my favorite:
BT = Bigger Truck
(as in, “Install this system and you’re gonna need a bigger truck”…to haul all that additional money to the bank. This phrase is rarely used anymore but doesn’t stop us from trying to come up with the “NFB”...or, impress the "BIY")

 

[2Biz]

10 minutes later and I'm still laughing!!! Good one CB80....I guess I missed a few!

 

[tdlconceptsllc]

RobertRoman

This is Crazy are you sure you have ever owned a Self Service carwash better yet writing about them. Presoak and Tire cleaner, foamy brush and Rinse are the most used components on any SS carwash We installed Tri color foam 15 years ago and still to this day is the least used product and we Chunk the Chemical to it. Tire cleaner is a MUST I have had chemical distributors try to give me pink tire cleaner and the old school customers thought I was giving them presoak and stayed very mad about it. If you want my honest opinion I see more customers spray the tri-color foam on and let the meter run out of time and take the brush with no foam and rub it into the car very common in my area. I honestly want to take the triple foam out of my site.


I have seen 40% of my customers spray Green tire cleaner all over there car because there so old school and one minded, I am a 3rd Generation SS carwash guy in my family and my grandparents and the old heads in this Industry said when Presoak and Foamy brush come out it was awesome in the early 80's late 70's.

If anything the SS hand dryers we installed have increased sales more than anything besides credit cards.
A Low pressure wax similar to Rain-X in the bay wand does better than Triple Foam in sales and better results on the Car.

 

[slash007]

Can you be more specific? What do you need a picture of? My foam gun is a typical foam gun on a swing away boom with curley hose...Yes, I run air with PS but also use the same foam generator as tri foam. The foam generators are above each bay. I have 4 inputs to the foam generators and 1 output to the bay. Inputs are, Tri-foam, Pre-Soak, Windshield washer fluid, and 1 air input. The WWF is for winterizing...

My original pre-soak came out the high pressure gun. By moving it to the foam gun, I was able to eliminate all the High Pressure CV's (12 in total) that were needed to keep from back feeding HP into the PS lines. When running PS through the HP gun, most weep systems have solenoids that turn off the weep when PS is selected to keep from diluting it further. Now that PS is on the foam gun, the weep shutoff solenoids are not needed. 4 more problematic parts out of the mix! You still have to have the "Main" solenoid that controls weep, just to clarify. Let me know what pictures you need?

Thanks for explaining everything so vividly, I can see it in my head now I already have extra wires running to each meter box, so if I add tri-foam I will likely just go to a 10 position switch. One thing I am curious about has been the tire shine. Not sure how well it does and if is something worth adding.

 

[2Biz]

If you want my honest opinion I see more customers spray the tri-color foam on and let the meter run out of time and take the brush with no foam and rub it into the car very common in my area. I honestly want to take the triple foam out of my site.

I'm trying to rationalize this. Most of my customers wash with soap, then apply Tri-Foam. This can be done in less than 2 minutes. Why would the customer let the time run out and then wash with the foam brush? Even IF they used the FB a little after the time ran out, no biggy, they would have to add the start price again to wash all the soap off. I would think you'd be money ahead?

My Tri-Foam gets used a lot...So maybe you aren't putting it on with enough pressure. I've also changed tips and increased pressure to where it doesn't spit and sputter. It may be perception that the TF doesn't get used much. After all, there are three buckets of soap feeding one gun.

 

[soapy]

I had a location with a triple foam gun that applied a 3 color polish/waX. It got used very little so I switched it out to Rain X and it gets used 3X as much. I offer low pressure Rain X in all my SS bays now instead of high pressure wax application.

 

[cantbreak80]

This thread has gone a little off track. Maybe I’ll start another topic so we can share what we had, what we now have, why we changed, and why we wouldn’t do it again?

So, Soonermajic, has your question been answered?


Anyway, I stand by my first reply…the container cost is irrelevant. A $5 container that requires a 1:1 dilution ratio is much more expensive than a $150 container that can be effectively applied at 1:150. And, to determine your “delivered to the customer cost” you’ve got to know your application rate and final dilution ratio. You may find that expensive pre-soak only costs 6 to 7¢ per minute…in my world, that’s a reasonable cost of goods.

For instance, I think 5¢ per minute is a good starting point for high pressure soap.
And 0.5¢ per minute should make great foam brush.
Of course, all this is moot if the products do not meet the most important criteria, your customer’s expectations.

 

[soonermajic]

I still don't know what Pre-Soak is most used. We did get a lil off topic, but no biggie. I used Lustra Drum Pack for Pre-soak. Works very good, but higher than a Giraffe's A$$. I am switching to Kleen Rite Mean Green, or something like that. It's 1/3 the cost, & mixes fairly close. Gonna try it starting tomorrow...

 

[Earl Weiss]

IMO there is an issue with SS cleaning solutions in that the general public is using them. For safety sake the efficacy may be sacrificed somewhat in the interests of safety.

So, while it may be possible to find something that cust the grime better is it safe for misuse and abuse.

it's like the guy who just complained that the pressure was weak because it did not immediately blast the ice off and the temp is literaly 8 degrees outside. . The pressure would almost take the skin off your hands. Much higher and it would likely damage the paint. Would it clean better? Probably, but who wants to chance the adverse effects.

 

[tdlconceptsllc]

2Biz

My Tri color foam is a solid stream of foam the strongest in color and pressure than anybody 50 miles from my site no joke. The Hispanics in particular will apply the Tri foam 8inches high on the vehicle then let the coin meter run out of time and use this brush over the Tri foam this is very common in my state I have talked to about 8 operators who have the same issue and I also don't even put a tip on the Tri foam so I can get maximum foam looks awsome foams excellent and works good but people just don't care. propably because I chunk the foam to the brush also I don't like the foam brush like shaving cream more chemical at my site more like 3 one thousands before the next foam blop hits the ground and splatters around 38psi air and people love it gets all over your car. Most Carwash operators give a Ton of air and it's hard to cover the car makes a more mess on the car so they have to spend more to rinse:

For preasoak I use armorall SS presoak orange scent in heated tank gives nice bubbles and melts the grime off cars
Trying Quest chemical Yellowjacket presoak at another site and it works just as good very nice sent both on a white tip in a 511 hydro minder People comment on it at least once a month

 

[robert roman]

“Robert Roman This is Crazy are you sure you have ever owned a Self Service carwash better yet writing about them.”

“….awesome in the early 80's late 70's….so old school and one minded…..”

If you happen to be located where people are old school and one-minded, then by all means use what works for you.

However, when the “problem” is how do I make money with self-serve wash in economically depressed area or a self-serve owner comes to me says I’ve lost 30 percent or so of my business, you don’t solve the problem by suggesting to do more of what’s not working.

 

[slash007]

I had a location with a triple foam gun that applied a 3 color polish/waX. It got used very little so I switched it out to Rain X and it gets used 3X as much. I offer low pressure Rain X in all my SS bays now instead of high pressure wax application.

Where do you get your Rain X from? I am thinking about switching my wax over to that. Maybe some name recognition with help.

 

[soapy]

I buy my rain x direct from blue coral. It is still priced high but has name recognition that others don't and it works well.

 

[Stuart]

There are many good products out there and the cost of the drum or bucket will vary as well as the number of cars each container can service. I use products from Blue Coral/ZEP and Auto Shine from KO Mfg.

There are a few suggestions on how to figure your cost of chemical you may try. I myself look for a product that I am very satisfied with & really works for me to take care of the job in cleaning the car.
My chem cost per car may be more expensive than most but first I am wanting the chemical that works to satisfy the customer. Get the cars clean and they will be back. I am not saying cost is not relevant, it is, but it does not solely drive my decision making.

My 2cents-call up several distributers in your area and talk (interview) to them about your location, show them around and ask for their input. Ask their suggestions on chems, additions and improvements, etc. You will find ones who want to sell you an their product and the ones who want to help you make money. You may find just what you need.
Compare some of what they talk about with what you read here.
Make great friends with an electrician!!They can be invaluable and ask them tons of questions and how to use a volt meter...

I think you should add clearcoat. I believe it would be the least expensive selection to add and used the most. Add a decal or 2 in the bay, add a hydrominder/tank in PR for the CC and a few hoses with solenoid valves plumbed/wired to the HP pump.
hope this helps.

 

[slash007]

I buy my rain x direct from blue coral. It is still priced high but has name recognition that others don't and it works well.

I googled and couldn't find any information on Blue Coral other than the in store products they sell. Is there a site specific for commercial car wash chemicals?

 

[Stuart]

ZEP now handles the blue Coral line for carwashing. They bought the carwash line of products from Ecolab last summer.