Cat pump seals (what a scam)!

[Rockstar]

I'm on my second set in three year @ $370.00 per set for a 3545. I have just over 50,000 cycles on the pumps to date,but like I said this is my second set. The pumps work fine ,but dip and that drives me crazy. I alway oil the plungers and change the oil so it's not lack of maintance.What is causing this to happen? My 2120's are doing the same thing? $370. for those seals kits is a scam

 

[phred113]

That might be cheap considering all the money you have made from them. There are a lot of parts in those kits and complexity. All that is not cheap. The parts, like the pumps, are made in Japan, the Japanese manufacturer has to make money, then Cat needs to mark them up over 200% (they are parts, you know), and then the distributor needs to make a living, then to you. It all makes sense when you understand what's involved. BTW, I might be wrong about the 200%, it may have increased.

 

[MEP001]

Remember these aren't just repackaged seals that you can buy off-the-shelf, they're custom-made for Cat pumps, and that alone increases the cost.

phred113 is right, dividing two sets of seals into 50,000 washes is only about 1?? a cycle.

To maximize the life, make sure the water supply is adequate, that it flows in one direction (You don't want a bypass regulator on one inlet and the supply on the other as this creates turbulence and aeration, which in turn causes cavitation), and you may even consider a CAT tube on the inlet.

 

[phred113]

If I could sell you the same seals (or nearly the same) for a lower price and they lasted just as long or longer, would you buy from me (or anyone)?

Do you think there is a market for non-Cat, Cat parts? Valves, seals, etc. J.E. Adams owes their start to this very action, but I wonder if it would work, again? Warranty is out of the question with these type of parts, but Cat never issues warranty anyways, so who cares, right?

The price of repair parts for any pump, not just Cat, are usually high. With so many Cat pumps out there, you would think there would be more knock-offs available. I'm just thinkin'....

 

[Greg Pack]

I've had several machines with over 50K cars and have not replaced a seal kit yet. Is this on a IBA? By any chance do you choke off the water supply to draw soap or wax through the pump?

 

[Rockstar]

I'll get over it!! I just think it sucks I had a great day today and watched that f**ken thing dip all day!!! Maybe I'm down too a penny a cycle now? It's only MONEY!! Does anyone around here snowmobile?

 

[MEP001]

I had a great day today and watched that f**ken thing dip all day!!!

Are you sure it's the seals? If it occasionally loses pressure it's a supply problem, not the seals. I don't know what "dip" means in this context.

 

[Rockstar]

It's doing the same thing from the last time.It's the seal with the spring I'm almost certain.I'm shut down down for rest of the weekend,because It's way to cold here Ohio and after three winters in business,by far the smartest thing too do! I'm sure the water here has alot to do with the failure of these seal,so since these are the card I was dealt,I'll play my hand.

 

[Doug P.]

I am probably a little slow but I fail to see how the fact that a business is making a lot of money means that you should not worry about the cost of your supplies.
I agree that the kits for the big Cat pumps seem overpriced. However when you compare the price of a kit with the price of a new pump it seems a little more reasonable. Cat is just charging what the market will stand. In many industries parts sales are more profitable than equipment sales.

Doug P.

 

[Rockstar]

MONOPOLY!!! It is what it is,but $370. for some o-rings and seals,I just feel ripped off!!

*Rockstar*

 

[MEP001]

As I said above, they're not just "some o-rings and seals," they're parts that are very complicated to manufacture, and they're not mass-produced. If you want cheap parts, go with General Pumps, which are designed around off-the-shelf seals, but you'll be rebuilding it twice as often. The General that fits your application costs $2,000 more than the Cat, though, so you'd probably still feel ripped off.

 

[phred113]

It is a self-inflicted monopoly situation. The loyalty to Cat, and blindness to using any other pump brand, has caused much of this situation. We only have ourselves to blame for being in this position.

I really appreciate those among us like I.B. that have used another brand, like Arimitsu, and talk about their quality and good experience. Positive experiences cannot be denied, so loyalty to Cat is not wrong. In a market with only Giant, Hypro, and General to pick from, I can understand why Cat has been able to keep a grip on everyone. I think we owe it to ourselves to promote a quality 2nd choice and build them up, or we will forever be taken for granted and overcharged.

With this said, I try to promote acceptance of Arimitsu pumps, like I.B., because I have met the people and I know a lot of people who have used these pumps over the last 40 years. Arimitsu is the #1 pump company in Japan industry, not the maker of the Cat pump. The people at Arimitsu seem nice and really helpful. It would be a shame to ignore a better product, and better service, in favor of a brand that does nothing for us anymore.

Enough of my soapbox, sorry.

 

[mac]

I'm doing my little part to help change things. I'm a dealer for Arimitsu and Magic Wand, and Magic Wand will build equipment with any pump I spec out. Try that with Ryko, PDQ, or Mark VII. But don't get me going about Cat pumps.

 

[pitzerwm]

The only thing that I've found wrong with the Arimitsu group is that they don't find it necessary to support the Forum.

 

[gohlman]

3545 Cat Pump

Had a 3545 on an in bay auto for 10 years. The dripping from under the manifold was always the low pressure seals. It gets worse if you don't replace them when they start and you take a chance of getting water in your oil. Water gets picked up on the plunger rods and carries back into the crankcase. You can order the 3 seals for a lot less than the entire kit and they are on the back of the back manifold and real easy to install. Saved a lot after I figured out that you can replaced them and not a whole seal kit. Seems that the Cat low pressure seal is a weakness on that pump. HP seals never gave me a problem and never lost pressure. Ten years and never changed them.

 

[dogwasher]

As I said above, they're not just "some o-rings and seals," they're parts that are very complicated to manufacture, and they're not mass-produced. If you want cheap parts, go with General Pumps, which are designed around off-the-shelf seals, but you'll be rebuilding it twice as often. The General that fits your application costs $2,000 more than the Cat, though, so you'd probably still feel ripped off.

They must be mass produced, there's a million cat pumps out there!
And Im sure those little o-rings and seals cost them pennies on the dollar

 

[dogwasher]

Yes your correct! The prices and mark up for those parts is rediculous!!
I repair HVAC equipment for a living, maybe I could repair the HVAC units at the Cat facility. How about I install a $80 dollar gas valve in there roof top unit and mark it up to.. lets say about $800 dollars.. do you think they would like it. Im sure they would call someone else. Oh thats right with Cat you have to buy there parts, they stick it to ya!

 

[jimbeaux]

I started changing out my Cat 310's with the Arimitsu 313's about 4 or 5 years ago. One of the best moves I made at the carwash. I did have to change out 3 o-rings on my first pump this year. About a 10 minute job. Another plus is the quietness of the pumps.
Oh, I too, have had to spend the big bucks on a Cat 3535 & a 3545 for new seals. OUCH!!!

 

[MEP001]

Oh thats right with Cat you have to buy there parts, they stick it to ya!

It is my opinion that you're being narrow-minded on the subject.

 

[dogwasher]

It is my opinion that you're being narrow-minded on the subject.

Were just saying that they make a big profit on there parts. Look them up on the stock market. There a big company$$$
Owning a car wash is not a huge profit, (not for me anyway) thats why we have to repair our own equipment and having to pay a huge mark up on parts does not help us.