changer addition...rowe vs. hamilton vs. american

[trs246810]

I currently run a Hamilton ER-60 with a new XE validator installed. I should have made it a Mars. My only HUGE complaint with the Hamilton has been the stacker...and yes, I purchased a new one...jams on a busy day hurt...I called Hamilton...removed the teeth...still had the problem. So, I run it without a stacker. I think it's funny the company that makes the stacker actually says it's normal to have to run it minus a part it comes equipped with...and for that reason...I'm evaluating other options on my second changer...yes, it will have a mars, but what should it be?...American or Rowe? My only experience with them has been as a customer in my days before I owned a car wash. I'm going to leave my Hamilton in place, but install an additional changer on the opposite side of my car wash (vending area)...which is where my changer should be anyway...not my design though. I'm going to start tokens in the ER-60 instead of the quarters it currently dispenses...my reason being I would like to push things more towards tokens without doing it all at once. I've been to my competition wash...he runs a new dual American changer...and it sucks bills so fast it makes my XE look pathetic. I have to actually help some customers with the XE validator...and yes I keep it clean. It just doesn't love ALL money as much as some of the other machines I've been around...and no, I didn't try to string my competition's changer. lol I just want to keep everyone happy...I currently have slugbusters accepting tokens/quarters in my bays as well as my vacs...vending machines are quarters only...which I'm wondering what my remedy for that may be...although the quarter dispensing machine will be beside my vending machines. I know this is a ramble...but I'm thinking of picking up a used Rowe BC200 to team up with my ER60...although with the mars conversion kit being so costly for a Rowe...it makes a cheap new American with a mars validator sound like a viable option.

 

[MEP001]

There have already been a couple of posts asking the same question, and the overwhelming answers are always "Hamilton with a Mars acceptor." Hamilton's hoppers are simple, sturdy and reliable, and the Mars bill acceptor is a workhorse.

If you convert your ER-60 to a Mars acceptor, you'll eliminate the troublesome stacker.

The biggest ptoblem I have with our DRS changer with Mars acceptors is keeping quarters in it. It just works and works.

 

[trs246810]

yes, I've read the other threads/posts...I just never found anything bad about Rowe...and I never made the connection with the Mars being able to solve my stacker issues I'm having with Hamilton. I have never read about anyone else even having stacker issues with their Hamiltons on here...possibly because everyone else seems to be using a Mars? And yes...if I had found this forum before my last validator purchase...I would have gone Mars then. So, you guys may be seeing a new XE on eBay soon. lol so, if that would really work?...I could easily go all Hamilton. what type of token options are there with my manual drop vending machines though? thanks again Mep!

 

[MEP001]

Mechanical vendors limit you to a token that's close to the size of a quarter. I know for sure that the common .984 token will work if you replace the coin mechanism insert, and will dispense from a Hamilton hopper with no modifications.

 

[washnvac]

I use American Changers with CoinCo. The American hopper does not need a retrofit for tokens. I use all .90 high security tokens. The CoinCo works fabulous with 99.9% acceptance---always. As well, the CoinCos are cheap to repair/upgrade. I have several spare CoinCos because you can buy a refurb unit for less than $200, new less than $300. Everytime I sent a validator to Hamilton for repair it was almost $300; then it only accepted about 50% of the bills. I still have 6 Hamilton changers, but I replaced all the validators with Iowas. No issues w/ the Iowas. Final thought-I highly recommend American.

 

[Greg Pack]

Unless something has changed Coinco validators can be strung, which makes them unsuitable for dispensing of real money, but I guess you're pretty safe with tokens.

Hamilton with Mars acceptor is the highest quality combination out there.

American's are cheapest. IMO, you get what you pay for. An old forum member once called them the "Yugo of changers". That may be a little severe because they are fairly reliable but if you compare their design and construction of Americans to any other changer (except Rowe) you will find the others superior. If you are on a budget the Standard economy series is a better choice.

I don't know this for sure but I imagine the Rowes have seen their market share decrease over the past decade. They are just too mechanical for my taste. In my areas Rowes are being pulled out and replaced with other machines. They work fine for a while but then become a real pain to keep running. I gladly got rid of my last BC-200s a few years ago and will never look back.

 

[I.B. Washincars]

Yes, the XE will easily sell on ebay. I see them on there from time to time. Regarding Coinco, they work well, but can be strung. Don't put real money in a machine with a Coinco, just tokens. I've owned Hamiltons and Americans and have gotten good service from both. I've never owned a Rowe, but from what I have read on this forum and the older forum versions, I never will.

Hamilton with Mars is the best bet.

 

[trs246810]

So everyone agrees that the mars would solve the jammed stacker issues I've experienced with the XE? I do agree that the coinco must have a very high accept rate...99.9 would be GREAT! The americans I've used suck even tattered bills up like a vaccum. I've found that people who hold onto the bill with the XE will get even nice bills spit back at them. Any resistance whatsoever given to the bill will most likely cause a rejection. I'm guessing this is the anti-stringing design of the XE? Does the mars suffer from this same issue?...AND...would you say the mars and coinco accept rates are the same? It's not fun to be the smartass that teaches customers how to let go of the bill in time to not have it rejected...and yes, this is a real challenge for some people...many times it's the elderly with poor coordination. Most people are fine with it...and thankful for the help when I show them...but then there are the customers you know would rather suffer instead of being helped in any way. So once again...I'm trying to make everyone happy...the customers with pristine bills to the funky...as well as myself by plugging my stacker back in.

 

[Austin]

Agreed. I had daily red lights on my 2 changers with my XE validators and it was the most frustrating thing of my whole wash. A friend came up to me and said I love your wash but the changers seem to be always out of money. Red light to customers means no money in the changer. So next week got my conversion kit from Jim at Etowah Valley and switched to mars and never had a jammed bill again.

Throw the XE's in the lake and get the mars.

 

[jprb]

We have both Hamilton w/ XE validators and American Changers with Mars acceptors.
The problems we have with Hamilton are more often a hopper issue than validator. I don't recall ever having a stacker issue. Maybe the bracket that holds the stacker on the back of the validator is bent or mounted wrong.

The American changers are at locations with bill acceptors in the bays and vending, so the changers is mostly used for change for the vacs (used less than locations with Hamiltons). Only issue we've had has been wadded, worn and torn bills shutting down the mars acceptor.

JPRB

 

[trs246810]

just called Jim at Etowah Valley...he was packing up for the show...but told me to call when he gets back...which I will...512.00 for the kit...so, I'm making the mars change soon. yes, I'm stupid for not knowing the mars has its own stacker...I saw that when I went to Jim's site. so, thanks for your help everyone...problem soon to be solved.

 

[washnvac]

Quick addition to previous post--- yes I have heard that CoinCo can be strung. But I use all tokens, even in my AC8001 auto cashiers. So nothing on site dispenses quarters. I have always figured that the best way to keep from getting strung, is to simply remove the contents for which the thieves want. Therefore I have used only tokens from day one in the business.

 

[Austin]

I did have a few hopper problems but it didn't compare to the every other day bill acceptance problems that I had with the XE validators. It was a huge relief off my back after I switched to the mars and will never use any other validator other than mars. I had 2 coincos in my Unitec's that dispensed coins and they both got strung. I could tell exactly when they were strung due to their accounting print out and then watched it on video but in the end they got me for some cash. Go with mars.

 

[MEP001]

I've had practically no hopper problems with Hamiltons, but I make sure only clean, dry quarters go in them. I've replaced all the hopper switches (None of the original ones lasted more than six months, but the replacements are all four years old now) and just had one hopper motor go out after well over 800,000 coins dispensed, and no other troubles.

 

[JMMUSTANG]

Quick addition to previous post--- yes I have heard that CoinCo can be strung. But I use all tokens, even in my AC8001 auto cashiers. So nothing on site dispenses quarters. I have always figured that the best way to keep from getting strung, is to simply remove the contents for which the thieves want. Therefore I have used only tokens from day one in the business.

I just installed the new Coinco acceptors yesterday.
They say that the stringing issue is no longer a problem with the new acceptors.
What I really like is that if the acceptor gets wet, when a customer inserts a bill it will push/pull the bill back and forth 3-4 times to dry the acceptor and then accept the bill. When my Mars gets wet it shuts down.
Also we have a new stacker that expands up to 650 bills.
The acceptors also accept $1, 5, 10, 20 and even 50's if you want.
Now that my vendor can accept $10, 20 and 50's I'm going to use it to vend out $25 gift cards for $20. Maybe even a $100 gift card for $70. Hope they sells.
I'm not sure if they're going to be at the show but if they are check them out.

 

[Gabriel]

Hamilton, Jim, and Mars. A great combination--hard to beat.

 

[washnvac]

JMMustang......American has a 1000 bill box, too. I have those on all my units. They are metal instead of plastic. They are $75, I think.

 

[Randy]

I'd buy a Hamilton before I bought any other changer. The Hamilton changer is a better constructed changer than the other 2 changers mentioned. The quality of the Hamilton cabinet is far superior to the others. As far as validators, you have a choice STA , XE, Coinco or Mars. The Mars you can get a 1000 bill box. My 1994 DRS still looks as nice as it did the day I put it in and works just well as the day I put it in. I think I've replaced one Hopper motor, 2 payout switch's since 1994 and upgraded the validators.

 

[Earl Weiss]

>>>I've had practically no hopper problems with Hamiltons, but I make sure only clean, dry quarters go in them.<<<

Heck, I realy don't worry if they are wet, unless it gets really cold which causes them to freeze in a lump Clean isn't so important unless there is a big wad of gum or something on it. Foreign matter is bad. A screw or piece of gravel will cause a jam. Have to say the Hamilton's are realtively trouble free. When there is trouble, it is usualy something I would expect would cause trouble in any mechanical device.

 

[JIMT]

If dirt accumulates in the hopper it will short people some coins. The dirt gets on the wheel and allows the coin to slip off when it hits the switch. You can drill some .25" holes in the bottom of the hopper to let the dirt drop out or just keep it clean. I think Hamilton makes the hopper with holes in the bottom now.
JimT