Direct injection System ??

[Tom Thumb]

Looking at going from Hydrominders.
too Direct Injection and wondering how other owners feel about Direct Injection.
I have no experience with Direct Injection , they appear to have some real advantages, several different manufactures , also can be expensive.
Any experience good or bad would be welcomed.
Thanks

 

[Greg Pack]

SS or IBA?

The Istobal is my first long term experience, they use hydra-flex system. It works fine. You do have to have everything balanced right so that it draws properly. A restriction (clogged nozzle or foam generator, too much air) or leak will get things out of balance and throw your dilutions off. I just recently discovered a buildup problem in one of my wax lines as it had drastically weakened my injector suction on that line. Overall, the system works fine but personally I wouldn't yank out an otherwise good hydrominder/pump system. If you're planning on adding new product(s) the injection system would make better financial sense.

I still like the old school hydrominder. I keep a few discharge tubes,foot valves, and diaphragms on hand and they seem easy enough to keep maintained.

 

[mac]

Greg described it like it is. To change over just for the sake of something new just costs money and your customers won't see any difference. That said, if you are adding more equipment to the place and need the space, then it might make sense. And they are pricy things. I think the cost is somewhere around $12 to $16K depending on options. I've had good luck with mine.

 

[Tom Thumb]

Looking at going from Hydrominders.
too Direct Injection and wondering how other owners feel about Direct Injection.
I have no experience with Direct Injection , they appear to have some real advantages, several different manufactures , also can be expensive.
Any experience good or bad would be welcomed.
Thanks

thanks for the reply , that is the kind of info. i was looking for.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Think about it this way. If you have Hydrominders and flo jets you keep an extra Hydrominder and a few repair kits on hand as well as a couple of FloJets nd you have lots of backup potential. For direct injection you need redundancy for the injector which is simple and easy but the pressure pump and motor starter as well. Which is simpler / cheaper and easier when something fails?

 

[Waxman]

in 15 years, the only problem I've ever had with a Hydro minder is when the chain fell the keeper. Other than that, I have never touched them. That's the kind of system I want in place.

 

[Earl Weiss]

in 15 years, the only problem I've ever had with a Hydro minder is when the chain fell the keeper. Other than that, I have never touched them. That's the kind of system I want in place.

My experience is not that good but I have about 60 in operation. Back flow preventers leak, they need to be re built, floats fill with water, But issues are easy to cure and all fixes are simple. and cheap.

 

[MC3033]

I love the control of Hydraflex. The flexibility is great. I’ve seen a solid ROi as well as we were able to see a drop in cost per car since we started using them.

They are fairy bullet proof systems but they do have more components, including more expensive ones, then a hydrominder setup. I would only recommend Hydraflex if you see large volume and can get the ROI

 

[Cool Wash]

Does any one have any idea about the total cost of Hydraflex system for a 7 bay SS?

 

[mac]

Not sure this would work for self serve. You would need about 28 injectors, give or take.

 

[DavidM]

Check out InnovateIT. They have a complete self serve system using dema rocket injectors. I installed it just over a year ago at a 4 bay. The show in the bay is much better than flojets can provide. My customers love it and use the low pressure functions a lot.

When I was shopping, Hydraflex didn't really have a system designed for self serve. InnovateIT's system has a controller to handle antifreeze for all functions and rotating the colors for triple foam and foam brush. Hydraflex would need another controller for those items.

I have Presoak, tire cleaner, 2 color foaming brush, triple foam, low pressure wax and bug remover.

David

 

[Cool Wash]

Thank you David. I will definitely check InnovatiT.

 

[mac]

Check out InnovateIT. They have a complete self serve system using dema rocket injectors. I installed it just over a year ago at a 4 bay. The show in the bay is much better than flojets can provide. My customers love it and use the low pressure functions a lot.

When I was shopping, Hydraflex didn't really have a system designed for self serve. InnovateIT's system has a controller to handle antifreeze for all functions and rotating the colors for triple foam and foam brush. Hydraflex would need another controller for those items.

I have Presoak, tire cleaner, 2 color foaming brush, triple foam, low pressure wax and bug remover.

David

OK I'll admit I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to looking things on the web, But just where is this InnovatelT?

 

[DavidM]

innovateitcarwash.com

They grew out of Hoffman Car Washes in New York. Tom Hoffman Jr used to show up on this forum occasionally to share some of the cool ideas they have tried at their self serves.

Unfortunately, I don't think they have much information on their website about the SS version yet.

 

[mac]

Looking at InnovatIT I admit it does have a cool factor. It also looks like it can be a single source for failure of ALL your as chemicals. Am I missing something? Wax man and Earl have real valid points about using the KISS principal.

 

[DavidM]

The pump is a potential failure risk, however I believe the slight risk is worth it.
It is a common pump, easy to get if needed. Having used similar pumps on both laser 4000s and RO systems, I have found them to be very reliable with a very low failure rate.

The customer experience in the bay is so much better than flojets can provide.

 

[MEP001]

The pump is a potential failure risk, however I believe the slight risk is worth it.

I've also seen a lot of these pumps in use, and they're usually the last thing that needs any work by a decade or more. My concern would be the solenoids and injectors. There's a wash near my home with new D&S equipment, and they have a ton of issues with solenoids and injectors. They're expensive and difficult to replace, some of then requiring the wash to be shut down for a couple hours. There's some failure shutting a bay down at least once a month. That rate of failure is twenty times as often as I have to change a Flojet. I could improve the customer experience of at least one function by using a Procon pump, which would only improve the reliability. I see no major improvement being made with direct injection for self serve.

 

[Earl Weiss]

The customer experience in the bay is so much better than flojets can provide.

Explain please.

 

[DavidM]

The combination of pump and injectors can provide more volume and pressure than a flojet. This creates a better "show" and application from the gun, especially when a foam gun is used. It also minimizes the changeover times between chemicals.
Most importantly, my customers are using it more than they did before.

David

 

[Earl Weiss]

The combination of pump and injectors can provide more volume and pressure than a flojet. This creates a better "show" and application from the gun, especially when a foam gun is used. It also minimizes the changeover times between chemicals.
Most importantly, my customers are using it more than they did before.

David

I cannot comment on "Foam Gun" only Foam Brush and Low Pressure applications. Suffice it to say you can't put 10 pounds in a 5 pound sack and a single flo jet easily handles 4 foam Brushes and many more low PH functions thru an .05 nozzle.