Fleck System Brine Tank Overflowing Wasting Salt

[mjwalsh]

We have 2 large Fleck Model # 3210s that interact with just one of the brine tanks that the water softeners came with. It also serves our laundromat & dog wash besides our self service car wash. This system we installed ourselves & is about 11 years old.

We are noticing on the floor that salt water is oozing out of the brine tank's overflow fitting & hose going to the floor drain. Anybody who is extra familiar with the Flecks ... we are hopeful they will tell us what is most likely the problem. Maybe our salt was not clean enough but this is the first time this problem has occurred! What specifically should we focus in on? Thanks in advance.

 

[PaulLovesJamie]

I'm not "extra familiar" but if this happened to me I'd assume there was either a clog (dirt, salt bridge, etc), a faulty fill valve (the part that stops the brine tank filling), or simply just too much water in the brine tank.

Brine tanks are pretty simple, I'd empty it, inspect the part that stops the water when it is "full", clean it all out, and refill (I'd just use a bucket). 1/3 full is the correct amount I think, but I'd look that up. Should only take 20 minutes or so.

Or maybe your 2 systems are refilling the brine tank at the same time, causing an overflow? That would fall into the operator error category Mike

 

[MEP001]

The brine valve in one of the heads is most likely leaking. Disconnect the line, one at a time, either at the head or the tank when the softener is not regenerating, and there should be no flow. The float valve in the tank is also bad (if it has one; larger softeners usually don't) but that valve is not meant to constantly hold pressure and will go bad. I wouldn't even waste the money to replace it.

 

[mjwalsh]

Yesterday, we disconnected the line to the brine barrel & cleaned the float & sucked thoroughly (with a shop vac) where the float assembly fits downward. As I suspected we found impurities that had accummulated ... as even bigger than pea size black hard rockish material etc. Sometime when the salt get low enough we probably should clean the entire brine barrel-tank. Not sure if another way more expensive salt would be enough of a gain purity wise than the Solar Softener Salt that we are using now?

No overflow problem this morning ... but the fact that there was still some water flow from when like Mep said the flow should not be there when the softeners are in non regen-service only mode??? So even though we do not have the waste on the floor ... I am thinking something needs to be done within the heads of one or both of the Fleck Softeners themselves.

 

[MEP001]

Yesterday, we disconnected the line to the brine barrel & cleaned the float & sucked thoroughly (with a shop vac) where the float assembly fits downward. As I suspected we found impurities that had accummulated ... as even bigger than pea size black hard rockish material etc. Sometime when the salt get low enough we probably should clean the entire brine barrel-tank. Not sure if another way more expensive salt would be enough of a gain purity wise than the Solar Softener Salt that we are using now?

The stuff you found may be interfering with the float working, but the float is a backup measure to the valves in the head. The debris is probably from the Solar Salt. I assume you're using the crystals? It's dried salt lake water and full of trash. If you let the tank run down, then remove and clean it and fill it with something of quality like Morton, you'll never have to clean it again. It also has additives that will extend the life of your resin, so the higher cost is worth it.

but the fact that there was still some water flow from when like Mep said the flow should not be there when the softeners are in non regen-service only mode??? So even though we do not have the waste on the floor ... I am thinking something needs to be done within the heads of one or both of the Fleck Softeners themselves.

Yes, that means at least one of the brine valves is leaking. They're easy to replace, just take the line to the brine tank off at each valve to see which one is bad.

 

[mjwalsh]

I wonder if either of the below Mortons would do just as good for the Fleck Softeners? One is crystals & the other is pellets.

https://www.menards.com/main/plumbi...rystals-40-lb-bag/1898047/p-1444441170934.htm

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Morton-C...uIdkvoHuYYHWrRp-35CqsoWSl95mn50AaAtY1EALw_wcB

We buy salt by the 40+ bag pallet. At one time with a previous softener way back in the '70s we used to only use pellets. I thought I observed the pellets bridging or solidifying more inside the brine tank but maybe there were other causes such as the water level in the brine tank?

We never did figure out how to change the mechanical cams properly in our Fleck Softener Heads ... I am pretty sure if we could figure out how & what to order we could get by with using a lot less salt which in turn would make spending more for the Morton bags less painful financially.

 

[OurTown]

I noticed when we bought our wash a year and a half ago that there was a little bit of black stuff floating in the brine tank. I read some salt recommendations here and decided to go with Morton System Saver pellets. I sorta forgot about it until this thread that the black floaties slowly went away. The previous owner was using something different but can't remember right now what it was.

 

[MEP001]

We never did figure out how to change the mechanical cams properly in our Fleck Softener Heads ... I am pretty sure if we could figure out how & what to order we could get by with using a lot less salt which in turn would make spending more for the Morton bags less painful financially.

The only cam settings you night need to change would be the brine refill rate. There is a sticker on the brine valve that tells you the tank refill rate, for example a red tag (3 GPM) and a two minute per pin control wheel means that for each cubic foot of resin in the softener there needs to be a gap of one pin before the final two on the wheel. That's minimum brining to achieve 20,000 grains of softening per cubic foot of resin. If your tanks are 5 cu. ft., you'll have a capacity of 100,000 grains, which you divide by the incoming hardness to get your capacity in gallons.

 

[2Biz]

I noticed when we bought our wash a year and a half ago that there was a little bit of black stuff floating in the brine tank. I read some salt recommendations here and decided to go with Morton System Saver pellets. I sorta forgot about it until this thread that the black floaties slowly went away. The previous owner was using something different but can't remember right now what it was.

A few years ago, I switched from Morton's to Diamond Crystal Solar Salt. It was supposed to be better for the Softener and a little cheaper. The cost wasn't the issue, it was just supposed to be better. Within a few days after cleaning the entire system and putting in the Diamond Crystal, the holding tank got this black slime on top of the water! I would sift it out and it would reappear in a few days....So I cleaned the Diamond Crystal out and put Morton's back in. The tank has been clear ever since! Lesson learned! I now use the Diamond Crystal to melt snow!

 

[OurTown]

A few years ago, I switched from Morton's to Diamond Crystal Solar Salt. It was supposed to be better for the Softener and a little cheaper. The cost wasn't the issue, it was just supposed to be better. Within a few days after cleaning the entire system and putting in the Diamond Crystal, the holding tank got this black slime on top of the water! I would sift it out and it would reappear in a few days....So I cleaned the Diamond Crystal out and put Morton's back in. The tank has been clear ever since! Lesson learned! I now use the Diamond Crystal to melt snow!

Did you ever try the regular type Diamond pellets? We have been tempted to try it because I think it is cheaper.

 

[MEP001]

The Diamond pellets is clean, but it has an issue with hardening in the tank and creating a dome over the brine. It also doesn't have the additives that prolongs the life and softening ability of the resin.

 

[2Biz]

Did you ever try the regular type Diamond pellets? We have been tempted to try it because I think it is cheaper.

Nope, just went back to Morton's and have been a Happy Camper ever since. I get the Mortons at Sams Club for about $5 a bag...

 

[mjwalsh]

Nope, just went back to Morton's and have been a Happy Camper ever since. I get the Mortons at Sams Club for about $5 a bag...

2Biz,

It seems like there is more than one kind of Morton's? Are you & MEP001 referring to the "Morton System Saver Pellets" ? How about: https://www.menards.com/main/plumbi...rystals-40-lb-bag/1898047/p-1444441170934.htm

We used to have a Lindsey Softener that a local guy installed for us ... he used to deliver the salt for us & it was always Diamond Solar which he said was the best & he did not recommend pellets at all. That fancy electronic Lindey dual softener system lasted for about 10 years the local guy then told us its life cycle was over that he would no longer service it for us ... that we needed to buy a brand new system from him. Boy was him & his wife mad at us for bypassing him & installing a Fleck System after reading about Fleck's reliability etc.

MEP001,

When we first bought the new Fleck softener system (from an online seller) & then talking with possibly Fleck's direct tech support ... there was some technicality with needing to order a special cam with fewer or more pins & then we got psyched out scared & just left it without fully optimizing for our specific local hardness ... I am pretty sure we are wasting salt like crazy. Hopefully we will get back to making another try when we are not quite as over-extended with our 32 laundromat washing machine control update!!!

 

[OurTown]

Actually Morton changed the name to "Clean and Protect" but I'm not sure if they changed the formula or not. It could be just a marketing thing.

 

[2Biz]

Was going to respond the same thing....All I can find any more is Clean And Protect. I bet its the same as the old System Saver. They also have one that's labeled Rust Remover but have never used it...

BTW, had my Fleck 9000 Head rebuilt last summer. Even though it was set to regin correctly at 9000 Gallons, the regin cycle was set about 3 times too long, like 2.5 hours long. Now it doesn't take no time at all to regin. Sometimes it is worth getting someone in that knows what they are doing. A service call could save you more in the long run.