Twodose
Active member
What settings for Air and Liquid on a Foam Brush System.
And are you using foam brush generators?
And are you using foam brush generators?
Foam Brush Air and Liquid Settings...
- Thread starter Twodose
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MEP001
Well-known member
I use generators - you can get foam without one, but I find it easier to adjust and to get a smooth, even foam with it.
The pressure settings aren't as important as the flow to the bay. If you don't have individual settings for each bay's air and liquid, you'll never get all the bays the same. Getting the adjustment right is more of an experience thing. It's best to start out with too little liquid flow, then turn up the air a little at a time. I prefer a lot of volume in the bay for those ignorant customers who go straight for the foam brush on their dry paint. If you get excessively thick foam before you get the volume you want, increase the liquid flow.
The pressure settings aren't as important as the flow to the bay. If you don't have individual settings for each bay's air and liquid, you'll never get all the bays the same. Getting the adjustment right is more of an experience thing. It's best to start out with too little liquid flow, then turn up the air a little at a time. I prefer a lot of volume in the bay for those ignorant customers who go straight for the foam brush on their dry paint. If you get excessively thick foam before you get the volume you want, increase the liquid flow.
Earl Weiss
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FWIW your experience / settings will vary based on your setupZ:
Mine is as follows:
8 Bays
Flow Jet with 1/2 hose T'd to seperate 4 Solenoid Liquid blocks.
No needle valves on solenoids. Adjusting air pressure to solenoids regulates flow.
3/8 Poly for air and liquid.
No Foam Generator.
Air and Liquid travel together thru 25 + feet of hose and handle generate Foam
Air and Liquid come together at manifold in trought above each bay.
Suggest as above. 40 PSI to pump, and 5 PSI to Air. Work from there.
Note, that with foaming stuff sometimes less is more. Trying to force more air or liquid thru the samll FB holes can actualy kill the foam.
Mine is as follows:
8 Bays
Flow Jet with 1/2 hose T'd to seperate 4 Solenoid Liquid blocks.
No needle valves on solenoids. Adjusting air pressure to solenoids regulates flow.
3/8 Poly for air and liquid.
No Foam Generator.
Air and Liquid travel together thru 25 + feet of hose and handle generate Foam
Air and Liquid come together at manifold in trought above each bay.
Suggest as above. 40 PSI to pump, and 5 PSI to Air. Work from there.
Note, that with foaming stuff sometimes less is more. Trying to force more air or liquid thru the samll FB holes can actualy kill the foam.
Twodose
Active member
Mep, where are you getting your foam generators?
I am at 12psi liquid, and 16 psi air.
I tried it at 20 on the liquid and about 18 on the air but it came out way to fast, there would be a foot deep pile on the floor by the time they finished using the FB.
I am at 12psi liquid, and 16 psi air.
I tried it at 20 on the liquid and about 18 on the air but it came out way to fast, there would be a foot deep pile on the floor by the time they finished using the FB.
cantbreak80
Maybe I need new clubs
This is what I use for "foamers".
It's a Hypro 3350-0082 inline strainer...1/4" FNPT or 1/2" MNPT threads on each end. They work great!
Or, make your own from PVC pipe and fittings, stuffed with pieces of plastic pot scrubber (Chore Boy) or 3M scrubber.
It's a Hypro 3350-0082 inline strainer...1/4" FNPT or 1/2" MNPT threads on each end. They work great!
Or, make your own from PVC pipe and fittings, stuffed with pieces of plastic pot scrubber (Chore Boy) or 3M scrubber.
Twodose
Active member
Where do you have them mounted?
I figured you could probably make your own, someone today told me what was inside them...
I figured you could probably make your own, someone today told me what was inside them...
My foam generators are mounted in the equipment room, they say they should be mounted out in the bay, mine work fine mounted in the equipment room. You can get them from "Windtrax" or from "Kleen-rite" I've always made the foam generators myself from a piece of 1" PVC Pipe. What kind of pump are you using that you've only got 12 psi on the liquid side? I run my G57 Flo-jets at around 50 psi on liquid side and about 55 psi on the air. Every car wash is a little different and they have different settings.
cantbreak80
Maybe I need new clubs
My system uses three ¼” poly tubes out to the roof-top mounted plumbing trough. The “generators” are directly above the booms…inside the insulated and heated trough.
Two tubes supply the liquid and air to a tee in front of the strainer/generator. The air line feeds the branch of the tee…it seems to produce better foam that way. The strainer’s outlet is plumbed with another tee for the freeze protection (windshield washer fluid).
From there, the tubing is upsized to 3/8” poly down to the end of the boom. So, the foam is produced directly above the boom and gets to the brush in about 6 seconds with pump at 50psi and air at about 30psi.
My old system had everything in the equipment room, fed with ½” hoses to the bays. It took nearly 30 seconds for foam to show up four bays away…especially in cold weather. The so-called freeze protection tried to use compressed air to blow out the entire length of the hoses…I spent many hours thawing out the brushes and hoses that first winter.
Two tubes supply the liquid and air to a tee in front of the strainer/generator. The air line feeds the branch of the tee…it seems to produce better foam that way. The strainer’s outlet is plumbed with another tee for the freeze protection (windshield washer fluid).
From there, the tubing is upsized to 3/8” poly down to the end of the boom. So, the foam is produced directly above the boom and gets to the brush in about 6 seconds with pump at 50psi and air at about 30psi.
My old system had everything in the equipment room, fed with ½” hoses to the bays. It took nearly 30 seconds for foam to show up four bays away…especially in cold weather. The so-called freeze protection tried to use compressed air to blow out the entire length of the hoses…I spent many hours thawing out the brushes and hoses that first winter.
MEP001
Well-known member
I make my generators from 1 1/2" PVC, just long enough to fit a single conduit clamp over the pipe to secure it. I drill and tap three holes, one on the end of each cap and one on the side after the first one is glued on. One single plastic scouring pad fills it. I mount it as close to the boom as I can so the fill time is as short as possible - the foam hits the brush in just a couple seconds.
pitzerwm
Active member
Be sure that you make them so you can take them apart, they will crud up and you will need to clean them out.
Twodose
Active member
The pump on the FB is:
Goulds G&L, 1x 1 1/4 - 6 , 1st1c1c3, Imp dia 5 3/16.
I can get 40 psi on the liquid side but when I set it that high there is way to much product coming out. (at 20 on Liquid and 15 on air it comes out way to much).
I don't see how you guys could be at 40 on the liquid and 35 on the air. I'll have to check tomorrow to see what the DR is for the FB, I am using Blendco products right now, so I think allot would depend on the DR to determine what the liquid and air settings should be.
Also when you adjust them should you run 3 or 4 bays at the same time? This is in a 7 bay wash.
Also I can't find anything online about this pump since it is an older model. If anyone has an idea of the gpm/ pressure output for the pump it would be helpful.
Goulds G&L, 1x 1 1/4 - 6 , 1st1c1c3, Imp dia 5 3/16.
I can get 40 psi on the liquid side but when I set it that high there is way to much product coming out. (at 20 on Liquid and 15 on air it comes out way to much).
I don't see how you guys could be at 40 on the liquid and 35 on the air. I'll have to check tomorrow to see what the DR is for the FB, I am using Blendco products right now, so I think allot would depend on the DR to determine what the liquid and air settings should be.
Also when you adjust them should you run 3 or 4 bays at the same time? This is in a 7 bay wash.
Also I can't find anything online about this pump since it is an older model. If anyone has an idea of the gpm/ pressure output for the pump it would be helpful.
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MEP001
Well-known member
Do you have separate adjustments for each bay, liquid and air? It sounds like what you're having to do is average out the flow with a pump that varies pressure based on volume. You should at least have a liquid regulator before the solenoids so the pressure is consistent to the bays.
I never have to clean or replace my foam generators, probably because they're 1 1/2". I know someone who makes them with 3/4" PVC and he has to take them apart and clean them once a year.
I never have to clean or replace my foam generators, probably because they're 1 1/2". I know someone who makes them with 3/4" PVC and he has to take them apart and clean them once a year.
Twodose
Active member
I do have separate adjustments for each bay liquid and air on each solenoid.
Also have regulators on both air and liquid. I did it that way per your suggestions on a post a couple of years ago when I was re-doing the LP functions.
I think I have to just play with it, until I get the desired settings, my original question was what everyone was using for liquid and air settings for the FB, and are you using FB generators
Also have regulators on both air and liquid. I did it that way per your suggestions on a post a couple of years ago when I was re-doing the LP functions.
I think I have to just play with it, until I get the desired settings, my original question was what everyone was using for liquid and air settings for the FB, and are you using FB generators
After reading thru these post again I guess I will ask...what problem are you trying to solve? I think I might not have picked up on an earlier part of the post where you said by the time your customer finishes using the foam brush there is about a foot of foam on the bay floor....so it sounds like you have plenty of foam and are looking for a way to keep the volume of foam down..is that it? I don't see how foam generators would help with that but since I don't use them I really can't comment on that. Are you sure your pressure gauges are reading correctly? In my setup if I set the air pressure higher than the product pressure I won't get anything but air in the bay as it over rides the product line and will not allow product in to mix...so the regulator and needle valve on the solenoid side helps control the total volumne of product into the the mix .... what happens if you reduce the product psi to say 12 and air to about 10? I think I would set both at 0 then slowly adjust product pressure to where you have a small amount of liquid product coming out then raise the psi of the air in increments of about 2psi and see if that works.
Earl Weiss
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Coleman has these as strainers in their shampooers. HAve had them fail over the years. A good reason not to have them in the trough.This is what I use for "foamers".
It's a Hypro 3350-0082 inline strainer...1/4" FNPT or 1/2" MNPT threads on each end. They work great!
Or, make your own from PVC pipe and fittings, stuffed with pieces of plastic pot scrubber (Chore Boy) or 3M scrubber.
Earl Weiss
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Another reason not to have them, particularly in the trough.
MEP001
Well-known member
If you're using too much product, work on the individual adjustments the way I described above. Set one bay the way you like it after you've dialed in the regulators, then leave the pressure settings alone while you adjust out the other bays.
The main liquid and air pressure settings are only to give you a controllable flow through the individual adjustments. If those are very coarse, use a lower pressure. If it takes 1/4 turn to make an appreciable change in the bay, you can use a higher pressure.
The main liquid and air pressure settings are only to give you a controllable flow through the individual adjustments. If those are very coarse, use a lower pressure. If it takes 1/4 turn to make an appreciable change in the bay, you can use a higher pressure.
pitzerwm
Active member
On my LP stuff, I added a flow gage, so I could adjust the liquids and it really made adjustments easy. I found them surplus.
Twodose
Active member
I was just curious as to what setting's others were using on the FB for air and liquid, and if they were using FB generators.
Sometime I think we get off track as to what the original question is, not that I don't appreciate the information, but rather would have seen more post’s like, I use __ psi on liquid and __ psi on air.
Also I found out the pump is 20gpm @ 43psi.
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