Foam brush plumbing...Attn: 2Biz

[2Biz]

I have the 1/4" poly x 1/4" npt fittings going from the manifolds out to the bays...I was referring to the "Inlets" to the manifolds. I ordered 3/8" poly x 1/4" NPT fittings to go from the flojet to the manifolds. I figured since I have (4) 1/4" poly lines coming off each solenoid manifold, then I would think you would need 3/8" poly supplying the manifolds.

Maybe I misunderstood your post when you referred to "Supply Tubing": " Could likely turn down the psi if the supply tubing were 3/8" but those "push-to-connect" fittings won't fit on my solenoid manifold blocks."

Beings how the 3/8 fitting would be on the end of the solenoid, then there shouldn't be any interference to contend with...

 

[Earl Weiss]

FWIW I run 1/2" Braided lines from the flo jets to the manifold blocks. 3/8" from the Blocks to the manifold above the bays.

If 1/4" [poly is working for you supplying the bays 3/8" supply to Block of 4 should provide enough flow.

Most flow charts start AT 1/2" Pipe (Sonny's has one in the back of the catalog) but if the ratios hold, changing the size by 50% (1/4" to 3/8") is a net flow difference of 2.7, or in short one 3/8: hose could fully supply 2.7 1/4" hoses, but as pointed out the smallest resriction will govern and the solemoid valve opening in the block is a lot less than the 1/4" hose.

So, why do I use 1/2" braided? Seems to work and easy to use. there is also a resiistance factor with smaller hose so it seems to just make sense to make it easy to supply the manifold block.

 

[cantbreak80]

Maybe I misunderstood your post when you referred to "Supply Tubing": "

Sorry 'bout that. I was referring to "bay supply" tubing. Your 1/4mpt x 3/8poly fittings will work just fine for the manifold "supply"...no wrench issues there! (unless you're using a worn-out "speed wrench")

As Earl pointed out...bigger supply lines = less restriction. On mine, it's 1/4" poly to the "magic roof pod" and 3/8" poly from the pod to the boom. It's very rare to see more than 3 or 4 bays operating on FB simultaneously...even at my 8-bay! The G57 will provide more than enough soap for your 4-bay.

BTW...suggestion: Get the IDEC memory cartridge for your new wizard program. Then, IF the outputs die, AND you need the magic juice to work, you can just plug the cartridge into the replacement controller. Genius!

 

[MEP001]

They are only $8.83 for two....I would think it would make for a cleaner install and easier to service. I will be using the 3/8 fittings attaching to a Kip (4) manifold Solenoid block...

That's not so bad - I needed 1/2" OD tubing fittings and they were $14 apiece.

 

[2Biz]

BTW...suggestion: Get the IDEC memory cartridge for your new wizard program. Then, IF the outputs die, AND you need the magic juice to work, you can just plug the cartridge into the replacement controller. Genius!

I saw the memory cartridges when I ordered my first controller. But I figured, since I have a laptop to transfer the data, it would be just as easy to do it that way. I WILL incoporate spst switches to bypass the controller in case of failure like you suggested. That would buy me time to get another controller installed and reprogrammed. But given your track record with Idec Controllers, I should never need a spare!

BTW, I checked tonight and my SFR system uses a (4) solenoid Kip. It uses 3/8" pipe x 1/4" NPT straight fittings on the outlets. It looks doable if you ever need to plumb one this way, but it is close. A box end might fit, but you may be right, you might have to take off more than one fitting to get to the ones in the middle.

That's not so bad - I needed 1/2" OD tubing fittings and they were $14 apiece.

KR has them for $15.80 for (2). They sell all the push to connect fittings in pairs. Thats still not too bad....

 

[cantbreak80]

"But I figured, since I have a laptop to transfer the data, it would be just as easy to do it that way."

I was thinking about the next owner!?!

 

[2Biz]

"But I figured, since I have a laptop to transfer the data, it would be just as easy to do it that way."

I was thinking about the next owner!?!

HA....So you're saying the Idecs will outlast me, Huh! Good point!

 

[cantbreak80]

By that time the Idecs will be old school and everything will be controlled from "The Cloud"!??

Never say never...I just went live with my "over-the-top" lighting control. It didn't work. Turned out, a brand new Omron DPDT relay had an issue...bad N/O contact. Ever see what happens to an ice-cube relay when you throw it against a brick wall? NOTHING! (But, I'm pretty sure I tore my rotator cuff.)

 

[2Biz]

"The Cloud"!

I learn something new on here everyday!

So did you wire in bypass switches or were you left in the dark?

Why Omron? I thought you were an Idec kind of guy.....

(But, I'm pretty sure I tore my rotator cuff.)

As long as it made you feel better....Mentally!

 

[cantbreak80]

Omron?...Grainer is only 3 miles away. Plus, I have spares 'cause you never know. (The benefits of big cities...3 Grainger branches, 12 Home Depots, 9 Lowes, etc.)

The Omron keeps the Idec Qs from firing IF timer2 is on. When T2 is off and T1 is ON, THEN Idec Qs are allowed to trigger. But, it the Omron fails...by-pass switches do allow T1 to control everything

I told you it was over-the-top!

 

[2Biz]

WOW...Lucky you! I have to drive an hour to get to the closest Lowes or HD...No grainger or anything like that is even within driving distance. I can usually get things faster and cheaper if I just order online!

Although ordering online can have its difficulties....Just got a box in the mail last night with some SMC fittings. I ordered 3/8" poly x 1/4" NPT elbows. I got 1/2" poly x 1/4" NPT....So it doesn't always work out as planned!

I have to ask, Why 2 timers?

 

[cantbreak80]

Re-read Post #52 in the "For those CFL converts..." thread.

 

[2Biz]

Ah yes, I forgot you had two seperate systems going there.

I'm starting to get the parts in for the install/change-over...Now I just need some more wall space! Its slowly disappearing...

 

[Twodose]

2Biz...
This is how I make foam without a foamer...

30 psi air
40 psi FloJet
Could likely turn down the psi if the supply tubing were 3/8" but those "push-to-connect" fittings won't fit on my solenoid manifold blocks.

View attachment 373

What ratio are you using through a hydrominder? 64:1 etc...

 

[Earl Weiss]

What ratio are you using through a hydrominder? 64:1 etc...

FWIW KR FB Cherry, with ultra lean tip. Prety sure it's 320 to 1. I will check again.

 

[cantbreak80]

It's been years since I set the system up...but I seem to recall it's 90:1...using Diamond Shine Foam-it.

 

[cantbreak80]

Twodose:
I recalled incorrectly...The Hydrominder is 75:1

But, more importantly, the volume delivered to each bay is 2 oz/min. The math tells me my cost per minute is .2 cents. (That's 2/10 of a cent...not 2 cents!)

 

[2Biz]

Is that ratio higher than what is recommended from the manufacturer? I use Warsaw FB soap and the recommended ratio is 36 ~ 64 to 1 depending on equipment and water condition. I'll have to look and see what tip I'm using.

So I'm wondering if I can dilute mine a little more once I get it changed over? I'm really looking forward to not having to switch over to winter FB soap!

2oz/minute doesn't sound like much?

 

[cantbreak80]

IMHO...the manufacturer's suggested ratio is just that, a suggestion. Since foam brush concentrate is typically neutral, there are no cleaning agents. The foam is for brush lubricity. The cleaning is provided by the friction produced by the customer's muscle power. If thick-rich foam can be created with 1 or 2 oz per minute, doubling the ratio only creates thick-rich foam that costs twice as much to produce. And, adds to the bottom line for the manufacturer.

Wasn't it the soap makers who invented tri-color foam systems? So they could sell three products instead of one? With the pitch that customers would be so enthralled by the colors that they'd use it longer? And the kids really love it?

Hmmm...that's not my experience. People don't come to my joint just because I've got entertainment for the kids...and kids own cars (usually). Most folks are "clock racers"...they want a clean car for as little cost as possible. Three colors won't make them slow down or make them want to come back. A clean car, every time is why they become repeat customers.

 

[2Biz]

Most folks are "clock racers"...they want a clean car for as little cost as possible. Three colors won't make them slow down or make them want to come back. A clean car, every time is why they become repeat customers.

I have to agree except for this one time when I got to the wash..A teenage girl was in the bay using the Tri-foam. She had it piled on her car so thick you couldn't even tell what kind of car it was. She was also painting the walls a Pretty Blue, Red, and Yellow! She took a picture of it and was sending it to all her friends. I let her go, thinking what the Hell, maybe it will bring in more business. Although I did tell her, she was going to have to clean all that off the walls....She did...But she sure was having fun.

BTW...(3) five gallon buckets of tri-foam soap lasts me about a year @ 120-1...It doesn't get used like you'd think.