GinSan / Industrial Vacuum

[Fabman]

How old is your vendor? The original models used smoked lexan for the shield over the display. This seemed to be a problem. It just might need a clear shield over the display.

 

[Earl Weiss]

NAother method aside from a bank / secured creditor acquiring the assets and selling them is an assignment for the benefit of creditors.
See http://cjbs.com/blog/

 

[chadrpalmer]

our vendor is less than a year old, its definitely a brightness of display issue...mr. empie, my sincere apologies, as a company we avoid excess phone calls whenever necessary, email is free...my address is chadrpalmer@yahoo.com, feel free to email if you can address this issue. thanks

 

[Fabman]

Sorry, can't help. Doug's pretty good at his job. Give him a chance.

 

[pitzerwm]

Self Serve 101, you have been told twice to email me. If you don't I will delete your post and ban you.

 

[pitzerwm]

Not paying bills

Well, its been about 2 months and Ginsan hasn't paid their bill for the past advertising. In spite of the personal guarantee no check as of yesterday.

IMO any vendor or user that has anything to do with "the new Ginsan" are foolish.

The "new" people that are running it now are the same people that were running it before the magic date when suddenly they didn't have to pay anyone.

You can bet that you won't see a Ginsan banner on this site in the future.

 

[I.B. Washincars]

If you want people to see this you should have just bumped it to the top, not make it a sticky so everyone will just skip over it. That's one thing I really liked about the old forum, no stickies junking up the top of the menu. JMO

 

[pitzerwm]

Pat, Maybe you have missed that when you login just to the left of Log Out, is a link to New Post, if you click on that you only see the latest post since you have been there last and near the top, you click on "view last read" and it takes you right to the end where you last read.

 

[bigleo48]

Whenever I read stuff like this is makes me nervous. When a companie like Ginsan/IVS goes under and resurfaces with no debt, it puts pressure on competing companies that have debt. At times the pressure is enough to make them go under and resurface debt free in order to compete. I've seen this sort of thing happen in the last decade in two sectors I've worked in.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Whenever I read stuff like this is makes me nervous. When a companie like Ginsan/IVS goes under and resurfaces with no debt, it puts pressure on competing companies that have debt. At times the pressure is enough to make them go under and resurface debt free in order to compete. I've seen this sort of thing happen in the last decade in two sectors I've worked in.

Thi siotuation does not mean it has no debt. Basic Scenario. Company owes $1 million to the bank secured by it's assets. Company defaults and Bank foreclosews on assets, or company turns assets over to the Bank. True, company mave have owed others $ over and above the amount owed bank.

Bank sells assets to New Owner. Whatever new owner pays has a debt service factor attached to it. So, while there may be less debt to service, there is likely some debt. Even if new owner breaks open the piggy bank and pays cash, there is still a time value of $ involved.

 

[bigleo48]

Earl,

Yes you are correct...usually 20% or less of the original debt is what I've seen. But my point still stands...this kind of stuff can create a competitive imbalance forcing others to adjust with lower margins or even chapter 11. If we see another larger carwash equipment provider go under and remerge...it might have a cascading effect in the whole industry.

BigLeo

 

[Greg Pack]

At this point I imagine economic pressures on any SS equipment only company are very heavy. Having a name brand debt free competitor can't help. Maybe the guys got a good deal, but IMO buying Ginsan would be like buying a company that manufactures drive in movie theater equipment in 1970. I bet total unit sales of SS equipment never return to that of 5-10 years ago.

 

[pitzerwm]

The new owners would have a debt to the bank, for the purchase but there would be no debt to anyone else. They only buy the assets of the company not the debts. The people owed money would need to sue the original "owner" which has probably filed bankruptcy, and gave the bank everything that they had because the bank owned everything that they had.

 

[bigleo48]

At this point I imagine economic pressures on any SS equipment only company are very heavy. Having a name brand debt free competitor can't help. Maybe the guys got a good deal, but IMO buying Ginsan would be like buying a company that manufactures drive in movie theater equipment in 1970. I bet total unit sales of SS equipment never return to that of 5-10 years ago.

And looming low cost products from China aren't going to help....

 

[mac]

The more I read and hear about this, the more I wish I was absolute ruler of the country. Ginsan basically shuffled some papers around and, voila, eliminated their accounts payable. I have been in contact with two people who they owed money to who will never see it again. And Ginsan has brazenly asked to do business with them again. For Industrial Vac, this is I believe the fourth ownership change in maybe 6 or 8 years. That would be going back to Mr. Doyle. I propose a little rebellion. I think everyone that can should charge things from them, and then just not pay them. Please don't give me any claptrap about legalities. They intentionally screwed people who trusted them. Legal yes, but it doesn't pass the smell test. If you have an open account with them, order away. Should you disagree with my comments, I suggest you contact Mr Barry Boyd for any future purchases, if that's what you like.

 

[Earl Weiss]

The more I read and hear about this, the more I wish I was absolute ruler of the country. Ginsan basically shuffled some papers around and, voila, eliminated their accounts payable. I have been in contact with two people who they owed money to who will never see it again. And Ginsan has brazenly asked to do business with them again. For Industrial Vac, this is I believe the fourth ownership change in maybe 6 or 8 years. That would be going back to Mr. Doyle. I propose a little rebellion. I think everyone that can should charge things from them, and then just not pay them. Please don't give me any claptrap about legalities. They intentionally screwed people who trusted them. Legal yes, but it doesn't pass the smell test. If you have an open account with them, order away. Should you disagree with my comments, I suggest you contact Mr Barry Boyd for any future purchases, if that's what you like.

How about people knowingly assuming the risk or insisting on getting paid C.O.D.?

 

[mac]

Hello Earl. I really feel that SOMETHING should be done. Your suggestion is a good start. What I think will happen though is that there are so many salesmen that sell to manufacturers, that some new ones will be bragging to his boss that he finally got the Ginsan account. I have always tried to keep this business aspect in mind when I run into different situations: If I'm smarter than they are, I'll find a way to profit from this. I'll put on my thinking cap and let you know what I come up with. Meanwhile any other suggestions are freely welcome.

 

[jprb]

Bill,
I was just wondering what the detail of your dealings with GinSan were. Were they not paying for advertising by the old company, or didn't pay for ads for the new company. This thread seemed to show up at about the same time as the IVS ad for their quick shipping on new vacs.

Thanks,
JPRB

 

[pitzerwm]

It was with the "new company", personally garaunateed.

 

[pitzerwm]

I have received the payment for their banners.