Help with JC Super Saver, wash is down...

[slash007]

I finally installed my JC super saver and I have some functions working, but have an issue with HP soap, wax and presoak. The issue I am having is that when I select wax, soap or presoak, the rinse solenoid is also turning on. Because of that, water is not being drawn from the hot water holding tank, and instead my hydrominder tanks for the selected function are getting filled with water. I have the system paired with the Ginsan push button doors and the decoder board. I have the motor starter dip switches set to on for those functions since the pump has to run, but the rinse solenoid is turning on as well and know that can't be right. Not sure if the issue is with the JC system or how the decoder board is communicating with it. Any help is greatly appreciated as I have been shut down for 5 days now and really need to get the wash back open. Thanks.

 

[washnvac]

Do not know the answer, but if it was me at the moment I would just unhook the common to all the rinse solenoids. Then you will just draw off the hw tank all the time. This will work to get you open right away. Then you can figure out the rest. The only extra hot water you will be using is on the rinse cycle; as soap and wax are hot anyhow.

 

[slash007]

Hmm. That's not a bad idea to get going. I have my hot water off anyway as I have been waiting to get everything running first. I guess I could just turn the water off to the solenoids since is it a separate supply and only feeds those and the weep. Would that work the same as unhooking the commons?

 

[washnvac]

I suppose that would. On my set up, all the solenoids commons are tied together, so I would unhook in just one place to get them all. Either avenue should work. Good luck.

 

[MEP001]

Could you have accidentally hooked the rinse solenoid in along with the motor starter output?

 

[slash007]

Could you have accidentally hooked the rinse solenoid in along with the motor starter output?

I did not as I didn't touch the wiring in the control box other than to hook up the Ginsan decoder. I just had to attach the function wires to the corresponding functions, then connect the motor starter to the motor starter wire. There are a row of relays on the top next to the omron plc that seem to be connected to the rinse somehow. I have no idea what their purpose is as I do not have them on my other super saver and can't seem to figure out where they go exactly. I thought that they were used so that the low pressure solenoid on the pump could be used for the presoak and the clear coat as that is where JC told me they usually put those relays when they want to make both the ps and cc low pressure, but that wasn't that case as the cc is still high pressure. I'll take pictures in the morning and post.

 

[mac]

I've seen many places with the ginsan boxes and Coleman pumping stands. I've also seen many strange things happening between the two. Good luck is about the best I can offer. We have been retrofitting many push button meter doors with the old fashioned rotary switches, as when they fail, you don't have to send the thing back for repair.

 

[MEP001]

If this wasn't a complete system you bought used (Ginsan doors and Coleman unit already wired and working when removed) then they may have used those relays to combine all the functions for another output that was already or you combined with the rinse. I'd suggest unhooking anything they go to and just run the rinse selection to the solenoid.

 

[slash007]

It wasn't a complete system with the push button doors. It actually came with Jim Coleman doors that had a 10 function rotary switch. No idea what they could have combined as the switch stack could have done that, right?

 

[slash007]

View attachment 943 View attachment 944

Here are the relays and the wiring. I know that the purple is the rinse solenoid wire and the orange is the motor starter wire, but no idea what the other wires are or what function the relay had in the past. If I pull the relay off, the rinse solonoid won't kick on for any function, but I am not sure what else was intended. I'm going to try and just by pass the relay and connect the purple wires together.

 

[slash007]

Bypassing the relay and just connecting the rinse wire seems to have fixed the issue. Solenoid only comes on for rinse. I am curious as to what the relay was used for. Now I just need to dial in the chemicals, seems like I need to use much larger tips than I used to before with this system.

 

[Greg Pack]

IIRC, I believe the relays are used for the wash down switch configuration.

 

[Greg Pack]

Now I just need to dial in the chemicals, seems like I need to use much larger tips than I used to before with this system.

Yes, you will need to partially close the ball valves coming from the hot water tank to the pumps to get enough suction, and you will still use a bigger hydro tip than many other systems. I probably use around a blue-medium brown tip for HP soap and wax.

 

[slash007]

IIRC, I believe the relays are used for the wash down switch configuration.

I'm sure that's it, the doors it came with did have a wash down switch/lock.

cfcw, Regarding the ball valves, I have them about half way closed. Is that enough? I'm using hard water for now, so I'm sure that needs a bigger tip as well.

 

[Greg Pack]

I think mine are closed a little more than half way. With the motor running and trigger pulled on the HP gun, close the valve until you hear chattering. Then, open the valve back up until the chattering completely goes away.

 

[soonermajic]

Don't guess it could be separate timers, in pumpstand & meter boxes, working against each other? Had That same issue with my GinSan The Ultimate w/ DH meter boxes.