Laser 4000 soap tips and questions

[Ontario Car Wash]

Hello friends,
finally got this thing mechanically running
now to learn about soap
what ive learned is that every reps soap is the best and doesnt clean anything unless double the tip size
so i purchased the powersolve 55lb along with purple passion and simoniz foamer
mixed as youve recomended
the simoniz is much foamier but pp smells nice
question is
can i add a splash of pp to the simoniz for smell
what tip should i run on injectors
what should lp psi be
what should it titrate at
what titration kit should I use
how many oz per car/pass
how many seconds is a pass roughly
what kind of cost should a basic wash run me i sell for $5
low pressure soap
hp rinse
spot free

thanks for your help

 

[PEI]

"what should lp psi be" = I like to start at 150 lbs psi on the soap pump and adjust up if needed. You should not need to go above 200 lbs psi.

"how many seconds is a pass roughly" = PDQ figured speed 0 to equal about 42 seconds with no Front Bug or Rear Double passes. Speed 9 should be around 27 seconds with no Front Bug or Rear Double passes. My personal timing on an Explorer is:
Speed 0 = 44 seconds
Speed 1 = 42 seconds
Speed 2 = 40 seconds
Speed 3 = 39 seconds
Speed 4 = 37 seconds
Speed 5 = 35 seconds
Speed 6 = 33 seconds
Speed 7 = 32 seconds
Speed 8 = 30 seconds
Speed 9 = 28 seconds

I don't use the same chemistry so I am unable to help with the rest of your questions.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

I have no heat to soaps
i have a 10gpm instant heater sitting around
can i plumb a instant 10gpm straight to the feed of the lowprss starite pump
or does it need to be gravity fed, and would it keep up, and will it be instant or some lag.
Otherwise was going to just feed it to the holding tank,
how hard is to hard a water to bother mixing soap with, my softner is below 1 granin street is around 10 grain
should i heat the soft or the street water be ok. I know the grain is hight didnt know if the hot water would help or just use the soft water is my thought. But am i really going to gain amazing results or about same.
Thanks again

 

[Ceverett]

You should absolutely NOT feed your chemical injectors hard water.....your chemicals will barely work with hard water and your injectors will constantly be clogging up

I would use the water heater to feed either soft or RO water to the LP holding tank

You will get better results using hot water with your solutions

I have no heat to soaps
i have a 10gpm instant heater sitting around
can i plumb a instant 10gpm straight to the feed of the lowprss starite pump
or does it need to be gravity fed, and would it keep up, and will it be instant or some lag.
Otherwise was going to just feed it to the holding tank,
how hard is to hard a water to bother mixing soap with, my softner is below 1 granin street is around 10 grain
should i heat the soft or the street water be ok. I know the grain is hight didnt know if the hot water would help or just use the soft water is my thought. But am i really going to gain amazing results or about same.
Thanks again

 

[whitescout]

You can plumb the heater into the starite, but I would add a NC solenoid to the inlet of the pump. The solenoid would be wired to the solution pump contactor, so it opens when the pump turns on. this way, if any of the Dan Foss valves have a leak, you will not drain a soap bucket.

 

[AlBuko]

You can plumb the heater into the starite, but I would add a NC solenoid to the inlet of the pump. The solenoid would be wired to the solution pump contactor, so it opens when the pump turns on. this way, if any of the Dan Foss valves have a leak, you will not drain a soap bucket.

That is a good idea, but I would install it on the outlet side of the pump. The pump could run dry if the valve fails to open.

 

[PEI]

The largest injector that you would need on a LW4000 is a 0.86 which restricts flow to 2.5 gpm, so a 10gpm hot water heater should be able to keep up and can be plumbed straight into the pump.

When it comes to hardness in your water, remember that the soap reacts with solids, it does not care if those solids are on a car or in the water. Simply stated, your soap will start trying to pull solids in the water out of suspension even before it reaches the vehicles surface. Everything you can do to limit or prevent this will provide more cleaning power on the surface of the car. This means soft water is better than hard water and RO water is better than soft for cleaning purposes. With 10 grains of hardness in your incoming water you should at the very least feed all chemical functions with soft water. RO is better but more expensive, you need to look at the difference in cost to determine if it is worth it for the difference in cleaning.

You asked if hot water would help your cleaning. The answer is yes. Both low pH and high pH soaps benefit from the addition of heat. Only surfactants are not helped with the addition of heat. I would ask someone more familiar with your soaps what is the ideal soap temperature for the ones you are using and then try to set things up to get as close to that as possible at the spray arch. You will loose some heat between the pump station and the spray arch. The outside air temperature will have some affect on this.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

So after experimenting
hot water does make a great difference
using water from the softner less than 1 grain is much better
"When it comes to hardness in your water, remember that the soap reacts with solids, it does not care if those solids are on a car or in the water"
using a much smaller tip size now with a much greater cleaning
thanks for the info

ive been trying to find the on board instant water heater that came with the 4000 mine was junk threw away cant find a replacement?

Back to the instant water heater:
Whats the smallest i could get away with 4.5gpm?
And i beleive you said i could just plumb into the starite with out a holding tank
the holding tank i have is just one compartment
* really hillbilly question
can i make a holding tank out of barrel and hydro and put a bucket heater in it
i know i could heat the water
but is the starite pump gravity fed or could i just stick a hose in to draw for the pump???

Thanks again
any 4000 guys what are tip sizes you been using on the powder and pp reciepe?

 

[sparkey]

I have a washworld razor and heat my presoak with a takagi on demand water heater. I can't remember the size for sure, but for some reason I am thinking it is 199,000 BTU. I feed the on demand water heater with soft water from the city water pressure. I have no tank. If you would like to see my setup my carwash is 5 miles from yours.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

Thanks for the offer be great to meet ya.
Your more than welcome to pop by if you are in the area look for a big silver dodge.
As we speak im plumbing in rheem 10gmp but this time in dont want to heat the whole tank (hp,uc) just the soaps
so can i just run the intake hose of the pump to the outlet of the heater.
And run street water to rinse. Right now im using hot/soft water for both, seems to be a waste.

So the million dollar question is can i go straight from the heater to the pump with a hose????

Sparky ill pm you my number if you every need anything thanks again

 

[whitescout]

You can plumb from the heater right to the starite pump, but if any of the Dan Foss valves leak, you will have issues. If any of the valves for presoak or foam polish leak, you will empty your soap buclets. if the poly or drying agent valves leak, you will empty the bucket, and overflow your cold water tank. As i posted earlier, you can install a soeloid valve on the inlet side of the pump, or as you posted, you could install one on the outlet side of the pump. It is very easy to install a Dan Foss valve on the bottom of the low pressure manifold.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

Thanks for all the input



what size? Dan foss valve would you recomend
and what would be the easiest way to wire
i was thinking tie into the stop signal so it opened when the car sign says stop and closed after
any thoughts?

Was going to replace the float system any remondation
how big?
Brand?

 

[whitescout]

The Dan Foss valves on your machine are 3/8". I have, and would use one of those. By using one of those, you would not have to stock a completely new item for back up parts. Just power the solenoid to open when the solution pump comes on. Just wire it to the coil for the solution pump. Easy peasy.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

Ok thanks everyone
recap
use hot water.........chemicals clean better than cold
dont use street water........water is to hard and kills cleaning power
hot water tank plumbed in and used a 3/8 danfoss at bottom of lp manifold
wired danfoss into inbay stop sign lite so that it wont bleed out and turns on when wash is ready off when done

thanks again for all the great help on to the next task
which would be a good float for rinse tank

pss... How many oz of the powder mix and pp are u using im at about 5 0z on a blue tip a pass?????
Which if my reciepe is right and cost is about 1 penny per oz.
I feel like i like it better at about 10 oz
anyways any input on oz per car would great i understand every one is different
just a ball park would set my mind at ease...

Thanks

 

[MDrost1]

I use the Walters 1" float in my rinse tank. With a homemade "water dispersion tube". A hose with holes drilled unit randomly capped off tab the bottom. To disperse the water randomly and noT set off the low water switch.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

So i plumbed heater tank into pump and put a 3/8 danfoss outlet side to open when soloution pump goes on
***however its making the hot water tank rattle and bang
any thoughts
if i elimante the danfoss no rattle
when it does rattle just for a bit as it loads up then goes away
next wash samething just as its loading then slowly goes away and then back again

thanks

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

Seems to have gone away for know two days no hammering?>