looking into either buying new or building a low pressure system.

[Kwoelke]

I have just recently inherited a 3 bay SS carwash 3 months ago, which I know little to nothing about. I am looking into upgrading or rebuilding our low pressure system that is currently non existent from my understanding. The old owner had something set up but its not working properly. Money is somewhat of an option, i am willing to spend a little more on something recommended to work well but if i can also build my own for half the price I would much rather learn how and do that. I have looked into air logic systems which run around $1200 per feature but just don't know enough yet.

From what I see the system I have now is gravity fed/just going off the water pressure from the city which seems to not be high enough. The old owner was also very cheap so just assume it was all DIY'd and put together cheaply.

Again i don't know a lot and have been glued to my computer researching all aspect of this wash. If you could break it down for me it would be greatly appreciated.


If you need any pictures or have any questions feel free to ask.

Thank you in advance!

 

[MEP001]

The Air Logic system is as simple as it gets. There's a Hydrominder that fills the tank with proportioned chemical, a Flojet pump that supplies pressure using compressed air, and two solenoid blocks to allow flow to the bays when called for.

Ideally you want the pump to run only when called for, otherwise you risk wasting your product down the drain if a solenoid fails to close properly. Air Logic doesn't have that, but it's easy to add a multiplexer and a solenoid to control air to the Flojet (or use an electric motor and pump).

I don't like the Air Logic system mainly because the tank has no lid. I want the tank fully closed to keep bugs and dust/debris out. I'm also not a fan of the block solenoids they use. For a small amount more you can use individual solenoids that are at once more reliable and can be changed individually, plus I rotate the solenoid to give better access to the metering screw.

 

[Randy]

Pictures of what you've got now would be a big help. Sometimes you don't need to replace everything.

 

[New Washdog]

After installing a self serve system at our wash and seeing how ridiculously simple the systems are I would definitely build the next setup from scratch. But without the exposure/knowledge, buying a system is so much more practical.

 

[Kwoelke]

After installing a self serve system at our wash and seeing how ridiculously simple the systems are I would definitely build the next setup from scratch. But without the exposure/knowledge, buying a system is so much more practical.

How much would you say the price difference would be between building and buying?
I agree though my knowledge really isn't all there yet but nothing i can't learn in a day from just researching.

 

[tdlconceptsllc]

Call Etowah Valley equipment and buy a wall mounted low pressure system with hydrominder you can't build one cheap and complete as there's comes with hose reels, plumbing fittings and all for like 1200-$1500 for a 3 bay. I wouldn't even think about building one. You can specifically order stainless manifolds also which I suggest

 

[New Washdog]

How much would you say the price difference would be between building and buying?
I agree though my knowledge really isn't all there yet but nothing i can't learn in a day from just researching.

Less than half the cost for building a system as apposed to buying a plug and play built system. I would buy the pump station and bay/meter box already built, but build the low pressure systems and wax/soap dilution systems my self.

 

[Kwoelke]

Call Etowah Valley equipment and buy a wall mounted low pressure system with hydrominder you can't build one cheap and complete as there's comes with hose reels, plumbing fittings and all for like 1200-$1500 for a 3 bay. I wouldn't even think about building one. You can specifically order stainless manifolds also which I suggest

Looks nice! Is that two low pressure setups that you have in your picture?

 

[tdlconceptsllc]

Looks nice! Is that two low pressure setups that you have in your picture?

Yes that's 2 different low pressure systems for a 4 bay.

 

[Kwoelke]

The Air Logic system is as simple as it gets. There's a Hydrominder that fills the tank with proportioned chemical, a Flojet pump that supplies pressure using compressed air, and two solenoid blocks to allow flow to the bays when called for.

Ideally you want the pump to run only when called for, otherwise you risk wasting your product down the drain if a solenoid fails to close properly. Air Logic doesn't have that, but it's easy to add a multiplexer and a solenoid to control air to the Flojet (or use an electric motor and pump).

I don't like the Air Logic system mainly because the tank has no lid. I want the tank fully closed to keep bugs and dust/debris out. I'm also not a fan of the block solenoids they use. For a small amount more you can use individual solenoids that are at once more reliable and can be changed individually, plus I rotate the solenoid to give better access to the metering screw.

View attachment 4032

What are those small solenoids called? Do you have a link? I’m also leaning towards getting a more Plumed/wired through Etowah. Thoughts on them?

 

[MEP001]

Fluid Control Solenoid | Kip Valves 359015-0231 E | IMI Norgren

This Kip Valves solenoid valve is a normally closed 2-way model. 1/4" NPTF port, 1/8" orifice, 150 PSI max pressure.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

Kip Valves 359015-023102 | 24V Side Metering SS Solenoid Valve

This Kip Valves solenoid valve is a normally closed 2-way valve with side metering. 1/4" NPTF port, 1/8" orifice, 150 PSI max pressure.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

The Etowah Valley system uses block solenoids, looks like it'll be a pain to service, and there's no pump control. At least the tank is enclosed.

 

[Kwoelke]

Is there a company that you know of that has a pump control attached to their systems? Could I just add a pump control to the Etowah unit?

could you also explain the reason for the pump control for me? New and not really sure what it would benefit? Thanks in advance

 

[MEP001]

Could I just add a pump control to the Etowah unit?

I build a pump control box using small relays, ends up cheaper and cleaner than multiplexers.

could you also explain the reason for the pump control for me?

Flojet pumps without some sort of control are "dead-headed" against the solenoids, which means if a solenoid to a bay hangs open the pump will run and flush your chemical down the drain. The most common way to prevent that is to add a solenoid to the air supply to the pump that only opens when that function is called for.

 

[Kwoelke]

I build a pump control box using small relays, ends up cheaper and cleaner than multiplexers.

Flojet pumps without some sort of control are "dead-headed" against the solenoids, which means if a solenoid to a bay hangs open the pump will run and flush your chemical down the drain. The most common way to prevent that is to add a solenoid to the air supply to the pump that only opens when that function is called for.

Do you have a picture of how you built and set that up?

Okay, I’m understanding that a little better. Thank you.

 

[MEP001]

Do you have a picture of how you built and set that up?

I've done several, didn't take any pictures of those, but I'll eventually build more and will get pictures then. It's also not complicated, it's just relays daisy-chained together. This is just the relays for one function of a six-bay car wash.



This is something similar, the cabinet was filled with PLCs and relays, one PLC had failed and the controllers to change timing and price had crashed ten years ago. I replaced it all with Dixmor timers in the bays and relays in the cabinet and wired the rotary switches straight to the relays.

 

[Kwoelke]

The Air Logic system is as simple as it gets. There's a Hydrominder that fills the tank with proportioned chemical, a Flojet pump that supplies pressure using compressed air, and two solenoid blocks to allow flow to the bays when called for.

Ideally you want the pump to run only when called for, otherwise you risk wasting your product down the drain if a solenoid fails to close properly. Air Logic doesn't have that, but it's easy to add a multiplexer and a solenoid to control air to the Flojet (or use an electric motor and pump).

I don't like the Air Logic system mainly because the tank has no lid. I want the tank fully closed to keep bugs and dust/debris out. I'm also not a fan of the block solenoids they use. For a small amount more you can use individual solenoids that are at once more reliable and can be changed individually, plus I rotate the solenoid to give better access to the metering screw.

View attachment 4032

 

[Kwoelke]

The Air Logic system is as simple as it gets. There's a Hydrominder that fills the tank with proportioned chemical, a Flojet pump that supplies pressure using compressed air, and two solenoid blocks to allow flow to the bays when called for.

Ideally you want the pump to run only when called for, otherwise you risk wasting your product down the drain if a solenoid fails to close properly. Air Logic doesn't have that, but it's easy to add a multiplexer and a solenoid to control air to the Flojet (or use an electric motor and pump).

I don't like the Air Logic system mainly because the tank has no lid. I want the tank fully closed to keep bugs and dust/debris out. I'm also not a fan of the block solenoids they use. For a small amount more you can use individual solenoids that are at once more reliable and can be changed individually, plus I rotate the solenoid to give better access to the metering screw.

View attachment 4032

do you know if i would be able to use these solenoids for my high pressure wax? or would they only be good for low pressure chemicals?

Fluid Control Solenoid | Kip Valves 359015-0231 E | IMI Norgren

This Kip Valves solenoid valve is a normally closed 2-way model. 1/4" NPTF port, 1/8" orifice, 150 PSI max pressure.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

Kip Valves 359015-023102 | 24V Side Metering SS Solenoid Valve

This Kip Valves solenoid valve is a normally closed 2-way valve with side metering. 1/4" NPTF port, 1/8" orifice, 150 PSI max pressure.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

The Etowah Valley system uses block solenoids, looks like it'll be a pain to service, and there's no pump control. At least the tank is enclosed.

do you know if i would be able to use these solenoids for my high pressure wax? or would they only be good for low pressure chemicals?

what is the difference between the two options? i see that one has a "side meter" and the other a "no meter". this may be a dumb question but is one better than the other? what do i need the mete for?

 

[MEP001]

The meter is typically used to adjust low pressure flow. Since you're just drawing wax, there's really no pressure on them and it'll work fine. I don't use metering on soap or wax solenoids. If the tubing from tank to solenoid to pump is roughly the same, you don't need them. If you want to fine-tune everything absolutely perfectly, those metering screws are barely better than nothing anyway.