Nu-Wall
- Thread starter 2Biz
- Start date
cantbreak80
Maybe I need new clubs
Because they advertise Nu-Wall-2 as "HF Free", I would suspect the original product contains Hydrofluoric Acid.
DANGER, WILL ROBINSON!!! HF can do serious bodily harm and can even lead to death if it comes in contact with human tissue. (Don't ask me how I know.)
DANGER, WILL ROBINSON!!! HF can do serious bodily harm and can even lead to death if it comes in contact with human tissue. (Don't ask me how I know.)
That's what I was thinking about the HF....It stinks that they don't publish the MSDS and will only give it to you if you are on file and have purchased....If you ACTUALLY needed the MSDS, wouldn't it be a little late by the time you get it?
I just got done cleaning my walls and used "The Works" toilet bowl cleaner. Its about 20% Hydrogen Chloride (Hydrochloric Acid) . The same stuff that is in other Wall Cleaners. Muriatic acid is also Hydrochloric Acid, but stronger...31-35%...I was tempted, but didn't. Even with the 20% Hydrochloric Acid, it worked but wasn't just spray on, power wash off. It worked great on the scum buildup, but didn't cut the stains.
I'm Just trying to figure out the safest way to clean walls? Anybody ever tried using a Steam Jenny? They get to around 300°. I don't know if that would be too hot for Extrutech or if it would even work? Just trying to think outside the box....
For now, Klean Wall from KR may be the way to go. But it has Sulfuric Acid in it....They don't even recommend a respirator unless using it in confined spaces...
OK....CB80, I won't ask you how you know! But I do understand, I don't think I want to mess with anything with HF in it!
I just got done cleaning my walls and used "The Works" toilet bowl cleaner. Its about 20% Hydrogen Chloride (Hydrochloric Acid) . The same stuff that is in other Wall Cleaners. Muriatic acid is also Hydrochloric Acid, but stronger...31-35%...I was tempted, but didn't. Even with the 20% Hydrochloric Acid, it worked but wasn't just spray on, power wash off. It worked great on the scum buildup, but didn't cut the stains.
I'm Just trying to figure out the safest way to clean walls? Anybody ever tried using a Steam Jenny? They get to around 300°. I don't know if that would be too hot for Extrutech or if it would even work? Just trying to think outside the box....
For now, Klean Wall from KR may be the way to go. But it has Sulfuric Acid in it....They don't even recommend a respirator unless using it in confined spaces...
OK....CB80, I won't ask you how you know! But I do understand, I don't think I want to mess with anything with HF in it!
Most wall cleaners contain some form of acid which means they should be treated with respect but none of them are as hazardous as HF or ABF. If you are really concerned I would suggest you try a steam cleaner with an alkaline cleaner. Keep in mind though, some strong alkalis, especially those with sodium metasilicate and/or sodium or potassium chloride, are not totally safe either and can cause serious burns. I would stick with something in the pH range of 10 with some solvency if possible.
Stuart
Member
I have used a phosphoric acid based cleaner from Navy Brand which has worked good for me in the past. call Marilyn 8003253312 x323. she'll get a msds out to you. they have many other products which may be used for walls too.
I don’t know why everyone is so afraid of using Hydrogen fluoride or Ammonium Bifluoride, they are both excellent cleaners. With the use of any chemical wall cleaner proper safety gear is a must. I’ve seen car wash owners slopping NuWall on the walls with a bus brush on a pole out of a 5 gallon bucket wearing nothing more than shorts, T shirt, and tennis shoes. These are the kind of people who give these chemicals a bad rap because they don’t understand the hazards they are dealing with or they think it’s not going to harm me. When we clean walls we do it at night when no customers around, in full rain gear, rubber boots, black rubber acid gloves taped at the cuff and eye protection, might seem like over kill but we think about our safety and take it very seriously. We can do a 5 bay car wash in about 2 hours.
I agree that HF/ABF is an excellent, inexpensive cleaner. Chemical companies have spent a great deal of money to come up with a substitute without success. However one must examine the risk versus reward for using it. I have been to a factory that manufactures HF. The employees involved in the process are dressed like astronauts. The plant is equipped with more safety controls than any other I have ever seen. The main use for it is to clean computer parts in small amounts in labs equipped with expensive environmental controls or etching glass. The chemists involved could not believe that anyone would consider using it in an open, uncontrolled environment like a car wash.
In my early days it was the key ingredient in the low pH application in touch free washes. In addition to destroying pumps it ate up concrete and in some cases entire sections of conveyors had to be replaced due to degradation cause by HF/ABF. I know you feel you take extraordinary precautions but it takes only one mistake by one using HF/ABF to potentially create serious consequences for you and your wash in terms of financial liability and physical harm. Diligent, regular use of many of the other wall/equipment cleaners on the market today will produce the same results that HF/ABF does with a much reduced risk of harm.
Here is information anyone using or considering using HF/ABF should be aware of
• HF is one of the strongest inorganic acids available, used primarily for industrial purposes (i.e., etching glass, petroleum refining, and electronics manufacturing under a highly controlled environment)
• When using HF at any known concentration that will clean, it will corrode most metals including stainless steel, attack concrete, pit glass, and negatively effect most painted surfaces.
• HF is considered Toxic and therefore a known poison when absorbed through the skin, ingested or inhaled. The effects of the exposure may vary based on exposure time, concentration, surface coverage and the size of the person.
• HF in a concentration above 0.5% may result in severe ocular damage to the eye. Fume exposure commonly causes eye irritation and can also cause ocular injury. Signs and symptoms may be delayed.
• OSHA’s maximum permissible respiratory exposure limit is 3 parts per million average exposure in an 8-hour period.
• Many insurers will not issue policies if they are aware that these products are being used, so be sure to check with your carrier for coverage if you are planning to use HF/ABF at your wash.
In my early days it was the key ingredient in the low pH application in touch free washes. In addition to destroying pumps it ate up concrete and in some cases entire sections of conveyors had to be replaced due to degradation cause by HF/ABF. I know you feel you take extraordinary precautions but it takes only one mistake by one using HF/ABF to potentially create serious consequences for you and your wash in terms of financial liability and physical harm. Diligent, regular use of many of the other wall/equipment cleaners on the market today will produce the same results that HF/ABF does with a much reduced risk of harm.
Here is information anyone using or considering using HF/ABF should be aware of
• HF is one of the strongest inorganic acids available, used primarily for industrial purposes (i.e., etching glass, petroleum refining, and electronics manufacturing under a highly controlled environment)
• When using HF at any known concentration that will clean, it will corrode most metals including stainless steel, attack concrete, pit glass, and negatively effect most painted surfaces.
• HF is considered Toxic and therefore a known poison when absorbed through the skin, ingested or inhaled. The effects of the exposure may vary based on exposure time, concentration, surface coverage and the size of the person.
• HF in a concentration above 0.5% may result in severe ocular damage to the eye. Fume exposure commonly causes eye irritation and can also cause ocular injury. Signs and symptoms may be delayed.
• OSHA’s maximum permissible respiratory exposure limit is 3 parts per million average exposure in an 8-hour period.
• Many insurers will not issue policies if they are aware that these products are being used, so be sure to check with your carrier for coverage if you are planning to use HF/ABF at your wash.
Last edited: