Pump Motor Noise

[Rodebaugh1]

I shut a bay down for unrelated repairs a couple of days ago. When I started back up and decided to test everything, the pump ran for about 2 seconds and popped the breaker. I initially thought I had a pump issue. Disconnected a few things and pulled the belt off of the pump and tried to run just the motor. This does not sound good. Any suggestions appreciated.

 

[MEP001]

It could be a dropped leg. If a 3-phase motor loses power to one of the three inputs, it will not spin up under any load and will trip the breaker or the thermal overload, but it can run with no load. That sounds like an electrical hum and not a bad motor bearing. It's also possible the motor has gone bad. Start by checking the power to ground of all three legs.

 

[Toms PTcarwash]

Your motor has greaseable bearings. Did you grease them?
Hard to tell from your video, but it sounds like the bearings are headed south.
What is the amp draw without the pump connected? It should be significantly less than the FLA amps on the motor plate.
If the amp draw is low, install the belt, not over tightened and open your unloader and see where the amp draw is under low load, increase the pressure until you hit FLA of the motor. If the amperage skys and the belt starts to slip it may be the pump.
Hard to troubleshoot from afar.

 

[MEP001]

Your motor has greaseable bearings.

No, it doesn't. Baldor 3 & 5 HP motors are not to be greased. It will only go into the motor windings and cause it to overheat and burn out.

it sounds like the bearings are headed south.

Listen again. Sounds like electrical hum. The easy way for him to check would be to listen to the motor spinning after shutting it off. Also, the symptom of throwing the breaker does not indicate a bad bearing. It would be so much louder if it got that bad that it would be beyond a hum, it would be a death rattle.

 

[Toms PTcarwash]

That motor has grease zerks. They are definitely ported directly to the bearings. and should get a pump of grease every once in a while.
Of course, do not over grease.

 

[MEP001]

That motor has grease zerks. They are definitely ported directly to the bearings.

Nope. First, the bearings themselves have no path for the grease to flow into the bearing. They are sealed and permanently lubricated. Second, unless you remove the plug on the bottom of the motor (Bet you didn't know that part either) the grease literally has nowhere to go except to squeeze out around the outer bearing race and into the windings. It's in the motor instruction booklet, and I've had them apart.

 

[I.B. Washincars]

I've only put bearings in a couple of Baldor motors. They were just as MEP said, equipped with grease fittings and no path for grease to go into the sealed bearing.

 

[slash007]

Nope. First, the bearings themselves have no path for the grease to flow into the bearing. They are sealed and permanently lubricated. Second, unless you remove the plug on the bottom of the motor (Bet you didn't know that part either) the grease literally has nowhere to go except to squeeze out around the outer bearing race and into the windings. It's in the motor instruction booklet, and I've had them apart.

I used to grease my Baldor motors until I had one fail and when I took it apart, the grease was everywhere as it had no where to go. One less thing on my maintenance list now.

 

[Toms PTcarwash]

Lubricant Baldor motors are pregreased, normally with Polyrex EM (Exxon Mobil). If other greases are preferred, check with a local Baldor Service Center for recommendations. Procedure Clean the grease fitting (or area around grease hole, if equipped with slotted grease screws). If motor has a purge plug, remove it. Motors can be regreased while stopped (at less than 80°C) or running. Apply grease gun to fitting (or grease hole). Too much grease or injecting grease to quickly can cause premature bearing failure. Slowly apply the recommended amount of grease, taking 1 minute or so to apply. Operate motor for 20 minutes, then reinstall purge plug if previously removed. Caution: Keep grease clean. Mixing dissimilar grease is not recommended.

 

[MEP001]

https://www.baldor.com/mvc/DownloadCenter/Files/LB5001

You're still making a bad recommendation, and you're still wrong about the noise.

 

[Rodebaugh1]

Well, now I'm as confused as every about the greasing requirements. Mine is a Model M3211T and is about 16+ years old and it appears to be obsolete. I first checked voltages and looked for a dropped leg. Everything checked ok. So, I pulled the motor. It was still quite noisy just spinning it by hand. I did pump a few shots of grease in the front and rear fittings before reading the instructions about whether to grease, how and what type of grease to use. My bad. It did slow some of the noise down but it still sounded bad. Since I only operate 4 of my 5 bays, I pulled the motor from my idle bay and installed it. It appears to spin just fine and is very quiet. I'll re-install the pump tomorrow and check it out. Since the bad motor is at least 16 years old, I won't even mess with trying to have it repaired. I'm not sure who originally installed the old Carolina Pride pump stand at my wash, but they certainly never intended for a 68 year old man with gout and bad knees to change out a motor. There was a lot of foul language used while trying to change out the motor on the bottom row of the stand. Thanks for the help guys!

 

[MEP001]

Mine is a Model M3211T

EM3211T is the direct replacement.

Since the bad motor is at least 16 years old, I won't even mess with trying to have it repaired.

It doesn't cost much to replace the bearings, but since it throws the breaker it has probably burned something in the windings. It will cost more than a new motor to have that repaired.

 

[Randy]

I'm not sure who originally installed the old Carolina Pride pump stand at my wash, but they certainly never intended for a 68 year old man with gout and bad knees to change out a motor. There was a lot of foul language used while trying to change out the motor on the bottom row of the stand. Thanks for the help guys!

Wait until your 70 and you have to do heavy work at the car wash, it takes me about 4 days to recover anymore.

 

[Keith Baker]

Wait until your 70 and you have to do heavy work at the car wash, it takes me about 4 days to recover anymore.

I feel your pain brothers.

I had to replace a well pump that circulates the floor heat this morning. Climbing up and down off of the concrete floor was a challenge. The hardest part was getting the unions to break loose after being in place for many years. I almost "phoned a friend" but put some heat on them and they let go.

 

[OurTown]

When you get old you need bigger tools.

 

[Keith Baker]

When you get old you need bigger tools.

The size of my tools is a whole other subject...

 

[designflaw]

Forgive me for bringing up an old thread to life but I am running into a similar problem. Here is what I am seeing,

Pump Motor makes a loud noise and then throws the breaker

youtube.com

Does anyone know if its the starter that might be the issue or am I looking at getting a new motor? When I try to get the machine to run, it starts with the noise u hear and then the breaker trips.

 

[Randy]

It's either the motor contactor or the motor. Try pushing in on the motor contactor with a screw driver to see if the motor will start. If it hums and blows the breaker the motor is bad. I think you have a bad motor or a bad start capacitor on the motor.

 

[designflaw]

It's either the motor contactor or the motor. Try pushing in on the motor contactor with a screw driver to see if the motor will start. If it hums and blows the breaker the motor is bad. I think you have a bad motor or a bad start capacitor on the motor.

Thanks Randy. I got a new contactor but that did not help. I had the same noise come out from the motor. I then tried a capacitor from a working motor and that also did not help. I am thinking at this point, its the motor. I ordered it thru zoro.com so hopefully it comes here before the weekend starts so I can install it.

Just out of curiosity, can these motors be repaired? and is it even worth repairing them?

 

[edredtop]

fwiw
When I first started in this biz, I bought an old wash and (of course) all 6 motors took a over the next three years. Not knowing where, how, or if it would be worth rebuilding one, I bought a new motor from Grainger for $600.
Then found that replacing a starter capacitor can get you going for a bit longer (a year or two), and it's worth it. Finally, a local guy was located that would take them apart and rebuild them as needed for about $100. Those rebuilds have been running for 14 years and we still have the first one we replaced with the new motor sitting on my warehouse shelf waiting for the call of duty.