Pump options for Spot Free

[OASIS WASH]

I bought a wash exactly a year ago and the low pressure functions are run from 4 Flojet Santo pumps. Spot free is one of those options and while I have never gotten a complaint, I am at my wash ALOT, and Ive noticed that people will start with it and see how long it will take due to the lack of volume coming out and will quit. Most hardly use it. I am wondering if there is another type of air pump I could use that would put out much more volume to get my use up. As you guys have said, Im selling time and if I can get some customers to use it, I will sell more time. I honestly can understand why they don't because it takes about 3-5 minutes to truly coat the car. I would like to stay with air because I am looking for a simple fix and I am not crazy handy! Any suggestions would be appreciated!

 

[MEP001]

The best pump for the price IMO is a Procon and a 3/4 HP motor. I use this pump:

Bolt-On Series 4 Pump | Procon | 104E240F11BA

The Procon Series 4 pump is designed for use at your busy car wash or other non-food contact operation!

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

and I add a regulator with the bypass returned to the tank

Blue Spring 555 Series Regulator | 5551090 | SMC Valves

The SMC 5551090 Regulator is a brass regulator with Buna seals and a blue low-pressure spring. 500 PSI,10 GPM, 3/8" FPT, 180° F.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

You'll also need a coupler set and a bell housing to connect the two. It can handle 250 PSI, but you'll need to check your solenoid MOPD. If it's lower than 250 you'll have to replace them.

I prefer to run even higher pressure with a Cat 390, but it would cost you at least two or three thousand for the upgrade.

 

[mjwalsh]

The best pump for the price IMO is a Procon and a 3/4 HP motor. I use this pump:

Bolt-On Series 4 Pump | Procon | 104E240F11BA

The Procon Series 4 pump is designed for use at your busy car wash or other non-food contact operation!

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

and I add a regulator with the bypass returned to the tank

Blue Spring 555 Series Regulator | 5551090 | SMC Valves

The SMC 5551090 Regulator is a brass regulator with Buna seals and a blue low-pressure spring. 500 PSI,10 GPM, 3/8" FPT, 180° F.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

You'll also need a coupler set and a bell housing to connect the two. It can handle 250 PSI, but you'll need to check your solenoid MOPD. If it's lower than 250 you'll have to replace them.

I prefer to run even higher pressure with a Cat 390, but it would cost you at least two or three thousand for the upgrade.

I could be wrong but since RO water is so aggressive possibly eventually deteriorating the brass etc ... my thoughts are that this pump in stainless would be better for the long term:

Low Vibration Bolt Style Series 5 Rotary Vane Pump | 105E240F31XX

The Procon 105E240F31XX Rotary is a stainless steel positive displacement pump from the Procon Series 5 line of pumps. Used for water circulation, boosting, reverse osmosis, desalination, and more.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

 

[PaulLovesJamie]

I would like to stay with air ...

I dont think you can get enough of a pressure/volume increase with air to get your customers to a) notice the difference b) perceive it as enough to convince them to use the sfr.
You need a noticeable difference to change customer behavior.

I would like to stay with air because I am looking for a simple fix and I am not crazy handy!

If Im not mistaken, you can get a 3/4 hp pump in 120V ... which means you can just plug it in. Dont have to be real handy to do that. The only other complication is adding a multiplexer to share 1 pump across multiple bays. Thats also quite easy, lots of us here can help if you need it. Worst case there are some good service folks in fl who frequent the forum... spend a few bucks to get it working properly if you have to, SFR is a heavily used and rather critical function to offer IMO.

FYI as usual MEP recommends a commonly used setup that is both straightforward and not cost prohibitive. I also agree with Mike, stainless is better for RO water; but it is more expensive.

Now that I think about it you are probably using wimpy solenoids for your air driven system? If so I'd also suggest upgrading them.

 

[MEP001]

I rarely see stainless pumps used on RO delivery systems. The few I have seen with a stainless pump don't seem to last any longer. Yes, purified water does demineralize brass and bronze, but in my experience the pumps tend to fail from use before they erode internally and quit pumping. Probably half that I've replaced were just leaking at the seal. Most of the rest just plain crater and release ground-up bits of the impeller into the solenoids.

 

[Greg Pack]

Solenoid and line sizing is important. Don't use a manifold block, but use individual solenoids and 3/8" line. The difference in flow is significant.

 

[OurTown]

We love our 400 psi spot free setup and get compliments on a regular basis. It would be one of the more expensive spot free setups but your customers would use it a lot. Our pump is a Cat 1010 but it is probably a tad overkill for our three bays.

 

[OASIS WASH]

The best pump for the price IMO is a Procon and a 3/4 HP motor. I use this pump:

Bolt-On Series 4 Pump | Procon | 104E240F11BA

The Procon Series 4 pump is designed for use at your busy car wash or other non-food contact operation!

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

and I add a regulator with the bypass returned to the tank

Blue Spring 555 Series Regulator | 5551090 | SMC Valves

The SMC 5551090 Regulator is a brass regulator with Buna seals and a blue low-pressure spring. 500 PSI,10 GPM, 3/8" FPT, 180° F.

www.kleen-ritecorp.com

You'll also need a coupler set and a bell housing to connect the two. It can handle 250 PSI, but you'll need to check your solenoid MOPD. If it's lower than 250 you'll h

Mac,
Right now I am running Dema 401 solenoids...it looks like they are rated for 150PSI. What solenoids would you recommend me using?
Also can you send me a picture on how I would attach the regulator to the Procon Pump? Does this procon pump just plug into the wall?

 

[OASIS WASH]

Mac,
Right now I am running Dema 401 solenoids...it looks like they are rated for 150PSI. What solenoids would you recommend me using?
Also can you send me a picture on how I would attach the regulator to the Procon Pump? Does this procon pump just plug into the wall?

 

[MEP001]

You can use Kip 3/32" orifice that are rated for 250 PSI. I would't go over 225 with them. If you want to maximize flow to the bay, there's a GC solenoid about $95 each rated for 2200 PSI that's full flow. The regulator just goes on a tee on the pump outlet, or you can use the flow-through model. You need a multiplexer like the IDX MX-8, and from there it just plugs into the wall.

 

[Randy]

Since you stated that "I would like to stay with air because I am looking for a simple fix and I am not crazy handy!" What air pressure are you running your Flojet pump at? Have tried turning up the air pressure? Installing a Procon pump set up might be a little to challenging. Your basically looking at replacing most of the system you have now.

 

[OASIS WASH]

Mac, what is a multiplexer and what does it do? I have never heard of that before.

Randy, I want to say they are set around 90PSI.

 

[Greg Pack]

The multiplexer replaces a bank or relays. You hook the bay input wiring to the multiplexer (such as the IDX MX series) and when it receives a signal from one of the bays it turns the pump on.

 

[Randy]

Here's a picture of a MX-8 Multiplexer. They aren't real hard to install.

 

[OASIS WASH]

So it sounds like this might be out of my realm of skill set, lol. I am assuming these procon pumps aren't "ready to go" like the flojet pumps!? When my solenoid turns on it just starts pumping the low pressure function that they are choosing on the meter box.

I'll try to find a guy local that can do the install.

 

[washregal]

On spot free - I have a 500 Gallon tank below grade - my spot free pumps are about 3-4 ft above this tank - I have a check valve about 2" from the bottom of the tank feeding up to a flex hose that is connected to my spot free mounted pump to come on for my SS bays. I am losing prime consistently - Could this be that the Spot free pump that is above grade does not have enough pull power to draw from the below grade tank? Do others recomend say a booster pump in the below grade tank to help out the above grade spot free pump? - will be replacing check valves this weekend and going through any leaks in lines - just trying to get my ducks in line for the possible issues.

 

[MEP001]

Are you sure the pump is losing prime? Do you actually see air in the line, or are you having to re-prime the pump? The only way it can lose prime is if air is getting in to replace the water, and that shouldn't happen if everything is right. It could also be the check valve from the tank sticking closed. I would suggest removing the check valve and moving the pump so it's below the water level.

 

[washregal]

I will try changing the check valve this week - I just bought a 1" spears ball check valve for that - However the pump will be really a major project to set at or below the tank.. Tank is massive 500 GA underwater tank - would need to drill through cement etc for that to happen - do you think the standard SF pump should be able to pull say 10-15 ft of liquid head from 4-5 ft below grade?

 

[MEP001]

It lists a 6' maximum lift. It could be losing prime through its own seal. I have seen someone use a Flojet to pump their spot free water to a secondary tank on the second floor. They kept it really simple and just used a float valve in the secondary tank with the Flojet dead-headed against it. I'd probably use a reed switch to control a low-voltage air solenoid to the Flojet.

 

[Rudy]

Skip the thought of burying the pump below grade. You've got some other issue.

My RO tank is buried. For 25 years, my Cat 1010 has pumped RO up at least 6 feet. There's a check/foot valve on the end of the hose in the tank which prevents backflow.

If I had a priming issue like yours....the first place I'd look....would involve the check valve on the inlet.