Tredle Switch Problem

[Red Baron]

My 2 new D&S i5000s came with new tredle plates. They appear to be the same as my old one but I'm having a lot more problems with the new ones.

On the old one, a pebble would sometimes get under the barstock stops that rest on the floor of the unit when the switch plate was in the upright position, preventing the switch plate from coming all the way back up. This of course shuts down the bay.

On the old unit this would happen a couple times a month, now it's happening 3-4 times a day. Additionally, now it happens with just mud, not a pebble.

I don't know if they've changed the cam'ing position of the plate or what, but it seems to rest in a more flat oposition when fully up, and the springs seem a lot weaker. I have put an additional spring inside the box in order to make it stronger but that didn't help...I'm thinking the angle has been changed and that makes the spring not reach the point in cam where it is the strongest.

Ideas?

 

[soapy]

My older ryko units had treadle plates also and were a pain. I replaced them with wide pressure pads and had very good luck with them. No need to worry about rocks getting under them and they worked all the time. I think kleenrite, dultmeier and others sell them. Just order some that a about the same footprint as the treadle plates and bolt them to the floor.

 

[Red Baron]

I just drove to look at a wash in South Lubbock who used a wide pressure pad on his new Quicksilver (looked like it was a 2 position pad for backup feature). On his Odyssey he did excactly what I was thinking of doing: He simply removed the flipper plate, left the rest of the tredle, and installed a pressure senor pad between the 2 raised areas. Said it works flawlessly.

Which brings up another question: Should I attempt to keep the air-operated portion of the tredle that raises to stop the car's tires in the right area, or just disable that leaving just a smallish bump? Obviously the air-operated portion makes it easier for the customer to stop in the right place, but is retainign it worth the added complexity? This guy disabled his and said he's had no problems.

MEP, chime in here buddy, your advice is always valued...oh, and yours too, Soapy.

 

[boywonder]

I got a 2 position pressure pad for sale. I was going to use it for a treadle switch but went to virtual treadle instead. Never used the color is blue. I have ohm tested the 2 loops and they do work.

 

[MEP001]

I've done exactly the same thing, removed the flipper plate and bolted a pressure switch across the whole thing. I don't recall why we ended up doing that, but it worked perfectly. It may have been an issue with the flipper plate getting stuck down.

 

[Jim L.]

I got rid of the pressure switch in my treadle a number of years back. It got to where I could only get 6 months of service out of one before they would stick in the closed position thus shutting down the auto. I think the brand was Recora, but I’m not sure. I didn’t bother to try another brand… just changed out the treadle for one with a paddle, counterweight and a mercury switch. I’ve been using it ever since.

 

[Red Baron]

I got rid of the pressure switch in my treadle a number of years back. It got to where I could only get 6 months of service out of one before they would stick in the closed position thus shutting down the auto. I think the brand was Recora, but I’m not sure. I didn’t bother to try another brand… just changed out the treadle for one with a paddle, counterweight and a mercury switch. I’ve been using it ever since.

Mine has the paddle, a mercury switch, and a spring. One pebble in the wrong spot and the paddle won't go back down - bay shut down. That may be less of an issue for those of you in the city, but we get mud every day even when it hasn't rained in 3 months (irrigated fields), and some of it has pebbles in it. When you have 200 pebbles laying around the tredle it's just a matter of time till one of them works its way into the wrong place.

 

[Jim L.]

We don’t have much gravel here in Florida. Just sand…lots and lots of sand. I will every now and then get a large rock under the paddle which causes a malfunction. I have the mercury switch adjusted that if the paddle only moves about 1/3 of the way down it will close the circuit and allow the wash to run.

I’ve played with the idea of making my own virtual treadle out of a couple of Banner electric eyes and a relay to complete the circuit. It doesn’t seem like it would be too hard to do. The hard part would be keeping the eyes in working order.

 

[pitzerwm]

Jim L, I would agree with you, but I'd suggest that you put in dual eyes, so that if one set goes out of alignment or failed, you would still be in business. I'd figue out what the units out there now use for safety. So that the car is where it is suppose to be.

 

[MEP001]

I do remember that the D&S paddle uses one side as the stopper, which is where dirt and pebbles get trapped and keep it from raising. If you could engineer a stop inside the cover and just cut the stopper side of the paddle off you wouldn't have the problem anymore. The Vector uses a pair of spring-loaded paddles not very different from the D&S treadle, but there's no way for them to get stuck down by debris.

 

[washme1]

I just drove to look at a wash in South Lubbock who used a wide pressure pad on his new Quicksilver (looked like it was a 2 position pad for backup feature). On his Odyssey he did excactly what I was thinking of doing: He simply removed the flipper plate, left the rest of the tredle, and installed a pressure senor pad between the 2 raised areas. Said it works flawlessly.

Which brings up another question: Should I attempt to keep the air-operated portion of the tredle that raises to stop the car's tires in the right area, or just disable that leaving just a smallish bump? Obviously the air-operated portion makes it easier for the customer to stop in the right place, but is retainign it worth the added complexity? This guy disabled his and said he's had no problems.

MEP, chime in here buddy, your advice is always valued...oh, and yours too, Soapy.

I have a conversion like Red Baron described on my Quicksilver. I left the air operated portion of the treadle in place. It is a major improvement, however I have seen another D & S IBA using two pressure pads which I think would be even better.

 

[Red Baron]

I do remember that the D&S paddle uses one side as the stopper, which is where dirt and pebbles get trapped and keep it from raising. If you could engineer a stop inside the cover and just cut the stopper side of the paddle off you wouldn't have the problem anymore. The Vector uses a pair of spring-loaded paddles not very different from the D&S treadle, but there's no way for them to get stuck down by debris.

The would be extremely simple - just weld some bar stock or angle iron to stop that vertical piece the spring attaches to.

I re-angled my mercury switches this morning in order to accomodate most pebbles so that should help, but long term I think I'll remove the paddle and install the pressure sensor pads...there's one on on the rear side of the tredle anyway, which tells the customer to backup.

 

[MEP001]

...there's one on on the rear side of the tredle anyway, which tells the customer to backup.

Yeah, that was a "stopgap" solution long ago for people who managed to bounce over the treadle stop. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone manage to get over the thing and then just sit there because there was nothing to tell them they had gone too far.

 

[Jim L.]

I didn’t have a problem with the pressure switch (back up light) on the exit side of the treadle. My problem was the one in the center of the treadle upon which the car sits for the duration of the wash. Sometimes they would take a long time to open and sometimes they would just stay closed. I fought them for 3 years before I gave up.

Good luck which ever way you go.

 

[Red Baron]

I didn’t have a problem with the pressure switch (back up light) on the exit side of the treadle. My problem was the one in the center of the treadle upon which the car sits for the duration of the wash. Sometimes they would take a long time to open and sometimes they would just stay closed. I fought them for 3 years before I gave up.

Good luck which ever way you go.

How long befoer they started giving you problems?

I'm installing Tape Strip brand; do you know what brand you had?

 

[Jim L.]

6 months to almost 1 year. The brand was Recora.

 

[MEP001]

I always used the ones from Kleen-Rite, which is the same brand D&S supplied for the entrance switch. The only time they would usually fail was if someone burned out on the switch and caused a leak where water could get in - I always thought about gluing a piece of diamond plate aluminum to the top.