My foam brush sucks - please help me improve it.

[Car_Wash_Guy]

I've read all the threads here on FB. I want to make mine like IIRC Earl Weis' shaving cream!

Using Blendco Pink Foam Brush with Blendco metering ( would like to change over to traditional tips)
Water is good - <1 grain of hardness.
Pressure is @ 30psi Product/40psi Air
3/8" poly lines to above bay where it is T'd and then passed through a foamer and down to bay.
Running Fluid-O-Tech pumps

I've tried multiple combinations of psi ratios. Equal, higher, lower, etc.
I've tried cleaning & adding more "scrungies" for more/better foam.
I've tried adding 16oz of additional concentrate to the mixing tank.
I've verified that air is indeed passing through solenoid&manifold and out to bay.


Pic of mixing tank

Video of performance:

https://youtu.be/9GsVRQT88do

Thanks for any advice

 

[Kevin James]

I’d be calling Blendco and have them come out and fix it. They are supposed to be the best soap guys, I know they are the most expensive. What is that white hose barb coming out of the right side of the gray block used for? If it’s open that could be part of your problem. It does look pretty weak, we have all of ours coming out like shaving cream.

 

[smallwash]

YouTube video looks like your foam brush solution is too weak. Mine looked the same when mine footvalve went bad and wasn't drawing up the soap as it should have been. May need a larger orfice tip to draw more soap

 

[rph9168]

From my experience there are no absolute truths when it comes to settings on a foaming brush. Every system seems to have its quirks. Did it every work properly? There are probably as many options or opinions as there are people here on the forum. Usually when it is so watery either the solution is being too diluted (which would be my first guess) or the air pressure needs to be increased. In any case I think you are in for more trial and error. You probably already know this but make only one change at a time to avoid over or under correcting and making it very difficult to find the problem.

 

[Car_Wash_Guy]

I’d be calling Blendco and have them come out and fix it. They are supposed to be the best soap guys, I know they are the most expensive. What is that white hose barb coming out of the right side of the gray block used for? If it’s open that could be part of your problem. It does look pretty weak, we have all of ours coming out like shaving cream.

Yeah, my rep did say that he set me up on the light end regarding ratios and keeping chemical costs down.

Not sure what the barb is for - perhaps some of the others here could explain?

YouTube video looks like your foam brush solution is too weak. Mine looked the same when mine footvalve went bad and wasn't drawing up the soap as it should have been. May need a larger orfice tip to draw more soap

I checked the foot valve and it seemed to be functioning OK.

From my experience there are no absolute truths when it comes to settings on a foaming brush. Every system seems to have its quirks. Did it every work properly? There are probably as many options or opinions as there are people here on the forum. Usually when it is so watery either the solution is being too diluted (which would be my first guess) or the air pressure needs to be increased. In any case I think you are in for more trial and error. You probably already know this but make only one change at a time to avoid over or under correcting and making it very difficult to find the problem.

Yes, I understand this. I guess I need to figure out my current mixture and proceed from there.

Does anyone have any general ratios on the rich side I could try perhaps in a separate mixing tank to try out?

Thanks for the replies!

 

[rph9168]

I think you are probably in the ballpark with the settings you listed. I have seen the air pressure as high as 60 but never lower than 30. The product range I have seen is usually between 20-40. If you are using the recommended tip I would start by titrating and/or doing volumetrics to make sure you are actually using the right amount of product. Sometimes even though you think the settings are right what ends up at the brush is not what you think it is. If that checks out I would probably adjust the air first because it is easier to work with even though I think it might be the solution. If that doesn't solve the problem then reduce the dilution gradually. I would like to have just a dollar an hour for all the time I have farted around with getting a foaming brush to work properly. I feel for you.

 

[DiamondWash]

Here is my tip setup for my Blendco Foam Brush Red we did away with the micro tubes on all chemicals because it kept clogging up, make sure your pulling the detergent from the blendco mixing tank. I have my product at 40 psi and air at 30 psi so the air doesn't restrict my chemical check valve. The current made product would have to be pumped out and refilled with the new ratio.

Just curious do you have Ryko Self Serve equipment?

 

[Earl Weiss]

If that white barb on the side is really an opening to the fitting where the other educators are attached it could be messing up the ability
of the educators to draw product.

I tried Blendco for a while.Maybe a month or so then I got tired of additional stuff going wrong.

 

[Car_Wash_Guy]

DiamondWash -

Yes - I also have a Ryko SS Equipment. I like it so far.

Thanks for that pic. Today I just pulled out the mini metering tubes and replaced it with the same tip as you have ( which was what my salesman suggested).

I checked everything today. I even added 30oz of concentrate to the mixing tank with absolutely no change in foam.

I went as high as 80 psi back to 0 and then increased it by 4 psi increments until I stopped back where I started. What I do notice is that the air/soap sputters a bit on the way through the tube and at the brush.

Tomorrow I'm going to remove the "scrungie" pad from the foamer and see if there is any change, but I'm starting to think this is most certainly chemical related. Can the Blendo soap foam like I'm wanting?

 

[MEP001]

I know of a few people who quit using the Blendco foam brush because it wouldn't foam. Could the Super Sat be killing the foam ability?

 

[Car_Wash_Guy]

I know of a few people who quit using the Blendco foam brush because it wouldn't foam. Could the Super Sat be killing the foam ability?

I was thinking that today. I might just make up a batch of just soap & water and see what happens.

 

[DiamondWash]

I use Blendco's "Rhino Foam Extreme" Red, Yellow, Blue for my foam brush, the Super Sat is the detergent side of the products without it equals no foam, and the barb on the side of the dual injector block is a anti-siphon device, Here is some my Blendco Products in action.

[video=youtube_share;94FJvqx6UF8]https://youtu.be/94FJvqx6UF8[/video]

 

[Earl Weiss]

Pressure is @ 30psi Product/40psi Air

I think it's wrong to have air pressure higher than product pressure. Are you using Flo Jets? If so, or any other air pump start with 40 PSI on the product and 10 on the air. Wait a couple of minutes before changes and increase air in 5 PSI increments . I think your air may be overpowwering the product so you are not getting enough and / or you are trying to put too much of both thru the brush which will kill the foam.

 

[cantbreak80]

Years ago, in an attempt to improve the “vivid” color of the foam, I experimented with “backwards” air and pump pressures. Here’s how it was done:
Air-assist = 80psi
Juice pump = 40psi

The key to making this work is controlling the volume of air. You must restrict the air flow dramatically by fully closing the metering valve on the air-assist solenoid. Then, barely crack the metering valve open.

With the juice solenoid’s metering valve fully open, close that metering valve ½ turn. Observe for 45 seconds. Repeat until the foam quality diminishes and you’ve found the sweet spot. The results? Brightly colored, shaving crème foam.

Now, the bad news…unless you have a very good air filter on the air-assist solenoid inlet, every two weeks or so you’ll have to fully open the air-assist metering valves to clear the blocked orifice.

Too much brain damage? Then, adjust your settings as Earl suggested:
40psi juice pump
10psi air-assist
Fine tune by lowering or raising the air-assist psi…5 psi per adjustment with at least 45 seconds of observation time. Once you have one bay set to your liking, repeat the settings for the remaining bays.

FWIW, I now use white foam, with pump psi at 40 psi and air-assist at 26psi. My air and liquid lines are 1/4" poly to the foamers and 3/8" down to the booms. The solenoid metering valves are wide open. Great show with virtually no maintenance.

 

[SteveA]

Car_Wash_Guy,

Sorry to hear you're having trouble with your foam brush. And of course I know it's hard to troubleshoot something from a computer, but when I watched your video I noticed that your solution seemed very watery (likely a product to air ratio problem), and the color of what foam there is appears white. When using Pink Foam Brush at the proper dilution rate the foam in the bay will be a nice pink color. This leads me to believe that your product is being over-diluted by the time it gets to the bay. I'm not sure how this theory aligns with you manually adding additional product however.

I would suggest you call your rep and have him come out and take a look. He can run through your settings, flow test usage to be sure you are using enough while staying at a favorable cost, and he can check to see if there is an issue with the product itself.

Hope this helps...

Steve Arnovick
National Sales Manager
Blendco Systems

 

[Bigdog]

I would really start by doing a volumetric draw of your usage per minute flow. I know the people from Blendco would like to help you with this. I would contact one of them. There ML per minute is usually the best in the industry when set up right.

 

[2Biz]

I don't know if you saw this thread, but read all the way through. There is Lots of info and several pics at the end. FWIW...I run my flowjet at 60psi and set flow at 20oz a minute using a needle valve. Air is set at 30 psi. I use SS scrubber pad loosely stuffed in the entire length of 3/4" x 6" long brass pipe as shown on post #67 in link below. The reason for 60 psi on flojet is even with all 4 of my bays running FB, the flow to each bay does not deviate. Setting the flojet too light on pressure will change ratio's depending on how many bays are using FB...Since setting it up this way over 2 years ago, I've never changed a setting. Still get shaving cream results.

http://www.autocareforum.com/showthread.php?9947-Foam-brush-plumbing-Attn-2Biz&highlight=foam

 

[chaz]

Check and see if there is a screw off cap on the outside of the tank where the chemical comes out. I've got these black caps that have a filter that needs cleaning from time to time.

 

[DiamondWash]

The Ryko self serve equipment uses procon pumps not flojets here is a picture of the Ryko S.S setup.

 

[Car_Wash_Guy]

Thanks everyone for all the feedback. I texted my salesman/rep the video that DiamondWash posted and he promptly replied and said " no problem, I'll come down tomorrow". That's pretty awesome being that he's 3 hours away!

DiamondWash - They're definitely Fluid-O-Tech pumps as I wanted to see if there were any history of these pumps causing issues. Not sure if they were OWM with the Ryko SS system, or the previous owners replaced them.

Chaz - I have a filter on the inside of the tank which passes through to a PVC shut off valve directly below. I'm gonna pull that hose from the pump and just verify that the soap is flowing and there are no blockages.

2Biz - My foam generators are PVC ( not sure if they are homemade or commercial) and had about 3" of yellow scrubbie/netting in it. Seemed pretty minimal.

Earl Weis - I have the numbers switched - 40 psi on the product and 30psi on the air. Sorry about that.