Ryko Top Brush

[SuperClean]

My ryko soft gloss top brush started acting up. The wash works fine and then when top brush drops it will not spin so it times out and the front door opens. It will wash 3 or 4 cars fine and the will do it again. When i open up the machine and push the contact in the brush spins fine so i don't think its a power or motor problem. If you have seen this before or have a place where i can start looking or if you know what tells the top brush to start. I'm guessing its not getting the signal to start the motor. Any help would be great I'm going to dig into it tomorrow. Thanks

 

[ken-pro]

My guess would be a tripped or faulty motor overload. These interupt the control signal to the motor starter when tripped. Could also be a faulty relay / PLC output that is supposed to signal the starter.

Does the motor starter "Pull In" when the machine attempts and fails to spin the top brush? If yes then the issue is in the high voltage circuit; if no then it is probably low voltage related.

 

[Jimmy Buffett]

Do you have an extra mac valve? I have had this problem before but am not sure what it was but something tells me it was the mac valve.

 

[RykoPro]

The Mac valve is for the air and would have nothing to do with the brush spinning. It could be the contactor coil is bad and not pulling in the contactor. There is also a hysteresis overload that will trip and then reset itself during a wash. I would make sure it is adjusted properly. The are located on the left side of the panel, there are 3, one for the rear brushes, one for the front brushes and one for the top brush.

 

[RykoPro]

It could be an overload. Ryko uses both the NO and NC sides of the overload relay. The NO side closes when tripped and send a signal to the PLC telling it the overload has tripped. The NC side opens when tripped and opens the common (wire 25) to its contactor and keeps it from pulling in. I have seen what I call a "half tripped overload". Basically the NC side stays open and the NO stays open too so the contactor will not pull but the PLC does not know the overload is tripped.

 

[SuperClean]

I was waiting for it to do it again but only 20 washes today and its working fine so when it does it again i will check this out. I hate it when its something intermittent i wish it would just break sometimes. Thanks

 

[SuperClean]

After waiting for a week for the tec he came out but we could not get the wash to go down (40 washes later)the only code he said that was there that might make cause it was the front brush proxy was on for 15sec after the wash. He wants to wait until it goes down again. If the front brush proxy was staying on would the top brush not start?
Last week after 10 washes it would happen but its my luck when the tec is there it runs no problem. Thanks

 

[DiamondWash]

Well if the side brush prox doesn't come on before the top brush drops then yeah that sounds right because the PLC thinks the the arm is still extended in the front the vehicle.

 

[RykoPro]

That may keep it from dropping but I thought the problem was it dropped but did not spin. Did you have the tech adjust/check the hysteresis overload?

 

[SuperClean]

That is the problem i guess it is not the proxy. The settings seem fine on the hysteresis and the wash is working fine today again. After a week of doing it everyday now i cant get it to do it. We will wait and see i will update you.

 

[SuperClean]

That is the problem i guess it is not the proxy. The settings seem fine on the hysteresis and the wash is working fine today again. After a week of doing it everyday now i cant get it to do it. We will wait and see i will update you.

Well it went down again and he came out and said there was no code (just 35 in step program too long) he doesnt think it could be the overload because i never have to reset it and the hysteresis is set right. After the machine rests for a bit its fine again if it sits for a day it will normally work the next day fine and then happen again in a day or 2.
He still thinks its a front arm proxy im going to change it out tomorow. He said the brush would drop if the front arm proxy was on just not start. Im not sure on this so i will try anything right now. Thanks

 

[DiamondWash]

Do you have cameras in the bay?

 

[SuperClean]

Yes i do but ive been there when it happens and i have had it do it on me when testing it. I turned the water off and ran it with the door open to see if it was trying to pull in the starter but could not get it to do it. Im stuck with a tech thats not the best but the only one around.

 

[RykoPro]

What he says maybe true, the only way to know is either by confirmation from the Ryko program engineer or by testing it with a toggle switch hooked to one of the front prox inputs. If he called customer service and this is what they told him, I would just change it out since installing a switch would be harder than installing a new proximity switch. You would think if the wash thought the arm was in, the top brush would not drop OR spin. How did he figure out which prox to change (right or left)?

 

[SuperClean]

No he never talks to anyone at Ryko but this is what he thinks it is. I think i might just switch both of them and hopefully hes right if not more money and more down time. Its just weird how it worked for 3 days this week after we shut it down sat and sun and then it happens again.

 

[RykoPro]

I am not sure its a front arm prox since there are never any codes and why would it only happen when the top brush is getting ready to drop? You would think if it were intermittently turning on, you would see it act up in other phases of the wash cycle. Have you looked at either one of the proxes themselves? Has the sensing surface been scratched? Usually you will see a failing proximity switch act up when it gets wet (they stick on). The wash will break down when you wash a lot of cars and it gets wet, by the time we get there, it has dried out so we spray water on them to see if it will stick on.

 

[SuperClean]

The prox looked ok but i changed it anyways so we will see. It only goes after we wash a bunch of cars. I wish i had you for a tech i would spend less and have it fixed in a day.Thanks

 

[SuperClean]

The tech came out and took a look at the proxy and noticed it was in the wrong hole from the factory so he put it in the right one and no problems so far. I guess when the brush would go in it would lose contact with the proxy. I haven't had any problems in 3 years but i replaced the proxy anyways. Last week was rainy but this week its been busy and no problems. Thanks guys

 

[DiamondWash]

Resurrecting this thread because I'm now experiencing this exact scenario the top brush will drop but not spin, the only code is 35 "in Program Step too long" Superclean hasn't been on the forum since 2016 it says so I don't know if replacing the front proxes was the fix for him. I can manually turn on the top brush and drop it with the use of my hand-held but the first customer next morning will have this happen to them and usually with 2-3 vehicles behind them ugh! Also, we replaced the motor just to eliminate that possibility but to no avail.

 

[Ryko CS]

You need to monitor your 24VAC side at the point in time when the top brush should begin to spin. For the top brush, check between wire 10 (24VAC hot for that section of outputs), and wire 25 common. If you are less than around 22.5VAC, it's likely not enough to pull in the contactor and you have something pulling down the voltage. Unlikely the front arm proxes would have anything to do with it. Before the top brush would be allowed to drop, the front arm proxes would need to be "off" to indicate they were in a retracted position. The top brush should begin to spin at same time it's told to drop.