Touchless Front & Rear Eyebrow removal

[GoBuckeyes]

Ok, I know lots of touchless operators claim to remove the eyebrow but who is REALLY removing it? We’re running Petit’s, Washworlds, PDQ M5’s & 4000’s. Lately we’re doing a bad job on the front eyebrow and even worse on the rear eyebrow of SUVs. We’re running Quest chemicals right now. I just went and washed at a Petit that I know uses Diamond Shine….no bueno. There’s a brand new typhoon up the road from my house, not sure what they’re using but it failed too.

If you’re really killing it, what are you using and how are you applying it?

 

[OurTown]

Are you using a high then a low (or the opposite) pH or just high? I have never seen a touchless truly remove the eyebrow. It seems that different times of the year is better though.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

We are and have always run lo then hi. I know this is a tough time of year to clean but for some reason the film lately seems to be very stubborn.

A couple of weeks ago I actually ran my truck through an express Tommy tunnel (Blue Falls) and it didn't even remove it 100%.

 

[kentadel]

We have a tough time for a short period every spring and fall. The answer for us (for the most part) is to either add a 2nd pass of low or increase the dwell before high. Haven't had any luck switching to high/low. Blendco products.

 

[traveler17]

Ok, I know lots of touchless operators claim to remove the eyebrow but who is REALLY removing it? We’re running Petit’s, Washworlds, PDQ M5’s & 4000’s. Lately we’re doing a bad job on the front eyebrow and even worse on the rear eyebrow of SUVs. We’re running Quest chemicals right now. I just went and washed at a Petit that I know uses Diamond Shine….no bueno. There’s a brand new typhoon up the road from my house, not sure what they’re using but it failed too.

If you’re really killing it, what are you using and how are you applying it?

I agree, like everyone here I’ve tried numerous chemicals and driven through lots of touchless washes. Currently using quest. I think I read on here one time someone said they could pass a white glove test w their chems. I’ll never believe it til I see it.

 

[slash007]

I have chased the eyebrow removal unicorn for 11 years. Finally was able to get it removed using Viper from Synergy. It's a polymer and I only apply one heavy pass. I have it working great at one wash 95% of the time on my G5's, trying to replicate it on my Razor now at my other site. Not sure how good it will do as the weather warms, but the past couple of months it's actually done it.

 

[traveler17]

I have chased the eyebrow removal unicorn for 11 years. Finally was able to get it removed using Viper from Synergy. It's a polymer and I only apply one heavy pass. I have it working great at one wash 95% of the time on my G5's, trying to replicate it on my Razor now at my other site. Not sure how good it will do as the weather warms, but the past couple of months it's actually done it.

Thanks for that , worth a try. How strong are you running it?

 

[OurTown]

Are you guys running heated presoak? If so I wonder if less air injection would keep it warmer. It might be marginally better though. From what I understand the issue with this time of year is that the oils are released from the asphalt because of the rising temperatures but not hot enough yet to help with the cleaning of it.

 

[slash007]

Thanks for that , worth a try. How strong are you running it?

Using a brown tip

 

[cbchevy4x4]

I have chased the eyebrow removal unicorn for 11 years. Finally was able to get it removed using Viper from Synergy. It's a polymer and I only apply one heavy pass. I have it working great at one wash 95% of the time on my G5's, trying to replicate it on my Razor now at my other site. Not sure how good it will do as the weather warms, but the past couple of months it's actually done it.

If you get good results on the razor please follow up. I have a edge and would like to see if i can clean better than i am now.

 

[Eugene]

Try JBS Venom PR-116 with there high PH boost . Works for me on Razor

 

[washnvac]

I have Laser 4000s and some friction machines with neoglide. I usually run my personal vehicle through the Lasers 2-3 times to one of the friction. After Lasers 2-3 times it gets that film build up. Sometime the eyebrow does not even come off in my friction machines.

So I am wondering this: Does the repeated washing in the Lasers which include peach spray sealant and body shield start to "seal" in that eyebrow, making it harder to remove next time? Each of those products claim to "seal" the surface, so could this not be true for the glass?

Just thinking out loud.......

 

[washnshine]

I have Laser 4000s and some friction machines with neoglide. I usually run my personal vehicle through the Lasers 2-3 times to one of the friction. After Lasers 2-3 times it gets that film build up. Sometime the eyebrow does not even come off in my friction machines.

So I am wondering this: Does the repeated washing in the Lasers which include peach spray sealant and body shield start to "seal" in that eyebrow, making it harder to remove next time? Each of those products claim to "seal" the surface, so could this not be true for the glass?

Just thinking out loud.......

Yes - the “next generation” super sealers/ceramics will start to seal in film that is left. Some chemical manufacturers make “TF” versions of these products that do not adhere you the surface as strongly (or last as long) to combat this problem. They are recommended for touch free environments.

I operate a friction tunnel and when film on a windshield is heavy and not completely removed, it is different from when it is not removed in a touchfree Wash. In a touchfree Wash, the whole outline and shape of the eyebrow is visible. In my tunnel, there will be about and 1/8- 1/4 inch line around the outer edge of the windshield (especially if there is molding that overlaps in that area) that the friction did not reach. Either way, it is a discrepancy in cleaning, but a different type of discrepancy, IMO.

 

[PEI]

Reliably removing the eyebrow requires constant attention to 5 details. They are water quality, water temperature, chemistry, impingement, and dwell time. With a touchless you can not just set it up and walk away. You must constantly check to make sure your draws and pressures are staying the same. These are the four setups that I have found solve the chemistry portion of the touchless cleaning equation.

JBS Action Line
1st Pass - AT101 - Brown Tip
2nd Pass - AT102 - Red Tip
2nd Pass - AT150 - Pink Tip
This setup is good with water hardness up to 5 grains and then it falls off fast. Water temperature needs to be as high as you can safely run through your pump. This is a Lo/Hi setup that requires at least 10 seconds of dwell time after each soap pass to fully remove the eyebrow through out all times of the year. You can reduce the dwell time during periods of easier cleaning. This setup is easy on the equipment but can be slow to pass out through the reclaim. This is JBS's most affordable solution but requires more time to work.

JBS COMPASS Line
1st Pass - CPS104 - Brown Tip
1st Pass - CPS105 - Light Blue Tip
2nd Pass - CPS200 - Red Tip
2nd Pass - CPS201 - Brown Tip
This setup is also good with water hardness up to 5 grains of hardness. Water temperature needs to be as high as you can safely run through your pump. This is a Lo/Hi setup that requires at least 5 seconds of dwell time after each soap pass but no more than 10 seconds to fully remove the eyebrow. This is JBS's best solution needing less time and allowing for more control throughout the year. This setup is slightly more aggressive yet still easy on the equipment allowing for limited down time. It is more expensive though.

Auto Lux Line
1st Pass - HP640 - Tan Tip
2nd Pass - AL-10 - Red Tip
2nd Pass - ALTP1200A - Burgundy Tip
This setup requires 0 grains of hardness. Water temperature should be between 119 and 115. This is a Lo/Hi setup that requires 10 seconds of dwell time after each soap pass to full remove the eyebrow. This is the most cost effective solution but it is slow and requires constant attention to the your water quality. This setup is very easy on the equipment allowing for less downtime and works well with reclaim.

CSI Lustra Line
1st Pass - 224 - Turquoise Tip
1st Pass - 515 - Turquoise Tip
2nd Pass - 205 - Turquoise Tip
2nd Pass - 715 - Orange Tip
This setup requires less than 4 grains of hardness. Water temperature should be between 105 and 115. This is a Hi/Lo setup that does not require dwell time after the passes. This setup will require more maintenance to your equipment. It is expensive but fast and leaves the vehicle with a final pH of 6.8 which is ideal for waxes and drying. Unlike most of the other presoaks on the market this one uses a special surfactant that breaks the oil film almost instantly. This requires getting the film moving before the surfactant evaporates and the film resets. If you can afford to run it this is the ideal soap setup for your Petit.

All setups have been tested for multiple years in a southern market with petroleum products being burnt off and creating heavy coatings of oil on the local vehicles.

 

[Legends]

I've been using a High " Boost " on newer 360s. Started using Zep boost around a year ago and recently switched over to National Automotive Chemicals 610 boost. During the initial measurement, I have a blast of High come out of Bridge that covers front of hood and windshield ( its on my menu as a "Seasonal Pass" but its the same throughout the year, a blast of High) I then run a heated Low and High pass, with a dual injector into high pass for the Boost. I noticed my cars have been cleaner than ever once I added boost. (It'll burn you so you really need to be careful while handling it). It's obviously an extra cost but I believe that cost is worth it as I've seen no "eyebrows" at either site. I've been super pleased and it really only cost a few cents more per car. Hope this helps, it did for me.

 

[soonermajic]

Maybe use HF ?

What Quest are you guys using, what tip, & how long is your dwell?

 

[traveler17]

I have Laser 4000s and some friction machines with neoglide. I usually run my personal vehicle through the Lasers 2-3 times to one of the friction. After Lasers 2-3 times it gets that film build up. Sometime the eyebrow does not even come off in my friction machines.

So I am wondering this: Does the repeated washing in the Lasers which include peach spray sealant and body shield start to "seal" in that eyebrow, making it harder to remove next time? Each of those products claim to "seal" the surface, so could this not be true for the glass?

Just thinking out loud.......

Good question, one wash I have a touchless that I run through regularly, the other wash I have friction and friction/touchless combo and sometimes friction doesn’t take off eyebrow

 

[ShinePro]

Ok, I know lots of touchless operators claim to remove the eyebrow but who is REALLY removing it? We’re running Petit’s, Washworlds, PDQ M5’s & 4000’s. Lately we’re doing a bad job on the front eyebrow and even worse on the rear eyebrow of SUVs. We’re running Quest chemicals right now. I just went and washed at a Petit that I know uses Diamond Shine….no bueno. There’s a brand new typhoon up the road from my house, not sure what they’re using but it failed too.

If you’re really killing it, what are you using and how are you applying it?

No eyebrows at my wash!
Razor 3
Chemquest products
Warm water 110 degree

High ph first - turned up titrating 25-28
Low ph next. - turned up titrating 10-12
this is about 1.5 times what is on the container instructions
Pre soak cost less than $1. Per car

I love chemistry
In any other commercial use of cleaners
Food service - dairy plants etc
High ph alkaline products always go first
Then acid
never understood why car washers were different

 

[jack954]

i used hf for years and never had an eyebrow problem. since i stopped i have tried many combinations without success. i did find one solution though. i went through my razor without success then went through an istobul that has a contouring high pressure pass (i set it up with same chemicals and titration as razor) and my front and rear eyebrows were gone. hot water presoak, 0 grains, and adequate dwell on both. we need the closer high pressure impingement. because of this test i wonder if the double barrel would do better with the eyebrows. unfortunately my bays are about 4” too short for the double barrel

 

[Fatboy769]

I then run a heated Low and High pass, with a dual injector into high pass for the Boost.

What chemicals are you using for the Low and High pass?