Washed out 310 manifolds - With pictures

[I.B. Washincars]

Odd to hear the Arimitsu service is better than Cat. Just curious...of the 20 Arimitsus how many were purchased?

I don't understand why you feel it is odd that they have better service. Actually, Cat didn't place the bar very high. They seldom, if ever chime in here to help out. James (no longer with Arimitsu) and Greg have always been willing to lend a helping hand here on the forum.

How many were purchased??? all of them 6 were original equipment on my Mark VII autos. The 18 516s I have were all bought and paid for by me and installed on my SS bay pump stands.

 

[Bethel Car Wash]

https://www.kleen-ritecorp.com/p-21381-arimitsu-516l-replacement-kit-3105cp.aspx
Kleenrite has the 516 for a little over $100. more than a 310. Other than the noise and customer service what are the other advantages to switching? Can they not wash out? Are they more reliable over all? I apologize if these questions were already answered. I haven't read all the previous comments but will get to them. I am having a 310 pump losing pressure right now and it's horribly load. I'm debating on trying to replace the seals which I have never attempted yet and or just replacing the pump and being safe.

 

[I.B. Washincars]

The 516 Arimitsu has more pumping capacity that a 310, but will fit in the 310 footprint. It has four outlets as opposed to the two that the Cat has, which makes plumbing it a bit easier. It can wash out in the seal area just as any other can. The valves are very robust compared to the Mickey Mouse ones in a Cat. I would be very surprised if one washed out around a valve.

 

[Main Street Carwash]

Replacing the seals is easy on the 310 but you really need a seal case tool. I have arimitsu 313’s at one of my washes and a mix of cat 310 and 5cp’s at my other. I did have 5cp’s at the one before the arimitsu’s were installed as part of a complete refit about 15 or 20 years ago. I honestly would say they are pretty comparable in performance and reliability. I don’t think either is appreciably quieter than another. Seal kits are a bit more expensive for the arimitsu pumps but the arimitsu pumps cost less than the cat pumps. I personally have not seen a washed out cat pump head although I have heard it happens to them more easily than arimitsu due to design. I don’t know if that is true or not. I do have a cat 310 that is still pulsing slightly even after a new seal kit so I will pull the head and inspect the seats closely. I have four pumps in the ER in boxes with the heads off of them that were there when I bought the wash. I don’t know if the previous owner just replaced pumps instead of resealing them or what but I am going to look them over really well and if they are washed out, I am going to have them sleeved with stainless sleeves. That way I will have some spares I guess.

 

[Bethel Car Wash]

That's what my middle bay pump was doing, "pulsing/pulsating" now it struggles to get up to pressure. I may attempt to put the seal kit in it. I purchased about a year ago. I have a few other heads. I guess I can inspect them and go with the better of the 3 and hope it works. When the pumps are sleeved do they come with the seal kit installed?

 

[Main Street Carwash]

If debris gets in a valve, it will pulse. Also if a check valve from the gravity feed tank isn't seating closed it will pulse and if you have an air leak in your soap or wax lines leading into the manifold it will also pulse. If its struggling to come up to pressure, I would be looking at check valve from tank, then trash in valves in head and seals of course. If the pump is only a year old, I seriously doubt it is washed out. I think some places just sleeve the head and some sleeve and install seals and all for a ready to install head. I doubt you need to do that though. Probably a seal kit if one of the aforementioned valves isn't the culprit. Don't forget to order a sealcase tool as well. Plenty of videos on youtube showing how its done.

 

[MEP001]

Replacing the seals is easy on the 310 but you really need a seal case tool.

I've found that a flat "wonder bar" prybar works just as well if not better than the seal case tool.

 

[I.B. Washincars]

He said that his pump is very noisy. That leads me to believe it's cavitating.

 

[MEP001]

I looked at a car wash the other day with GinSan equipment from around 2005. There are two brass manifolds bolted to the stand by each pump, one for water inlet and one for high pressure out. Every single bay cavitates all the time when the trigger is pulled, I believe because it has Cat 5CP6120 pumps with a 5" pump pulley.

 

[Greg Pack]

Bethel, check your check valve o rings too.

Cats are so reliable and easy to work on I'm not too motivated to change brands.

 

[washnvac]

Bethel, check your check valve o rings too.

Cats are so reliable and easy to work on I'm not too motivated to change brands.

Agree with Greg.

 

[mjc3333]

310 cat pumps washout

I have had 6 pump heads re-sleeved for pitting on the high pressure seat. Had it done 8 years ago. So far so good. As far as washout on other brands, they will all washout eventually. The Arimitsu pumps do washout. Both vendors that re-sleeve the cat pumps have been getting calls about the Arimitsu pumps. Currently they do not have a fix as they do with the cat pumps. I am sticking with the cat pumps.

 

[2Biz]

I figured this post was fitting for the Sticky Thread....

My most busiest bay started making noise about 2-3 weeks ago. Finally got a chance to replace the pump and take the old one apart. The head was a mess. It had one HP washout in the head, but not bad. One place about .060" wide and about .015" deep. The HP seals even wore into the Brass Seal Cases about .035-.040" deep! Can't believe this head still produced 1200psi! Anyway, with needing new seal cases, I don't think it would be cost effective to sleeve the head with SS inserts and put in all new seals/seal cases.

So looking at Kr's 310 head pricing, a standard 310 head is $480 and a 310S head is $542....But then complete pumps are only about $100 more for either standard or SS sleeved. That seems way out of balance!


Anyway, which way would you go? Standard Head, SS Sleeved head, Standard Pump, or 310S pump? BTW, I believe this pump is about 33 years old! The old Brass Head Design!

 

[slash007]

Those are pretty bad. I've always just had them resleeved using Vilco or KR and they seem to be doing well. Had 4 out of 5 done so far. At my other wash I just replaced my pumps with Arimitsu when I put in my new pump stand. You should consider that as an option if you want to go the route of a new pump. Otherwise usually the rest of the pump lasts forever, so it's easier and slightly cheaper to just to the head.

 

[2Biz]

Its kind of hard to switch gears with a new pump manufacture when I have 3 spare 310's on the shelf. I had two heads sleeved by Vilco 2 years ago and put them on the shelf. Today the curiosity got the best of me and I took one apart. Here's some pics of the head they repaired. I had them do the HP seats and sleeve all 6 valves. Note that they don't exactly sleeve the HP seats. They bore the seat oversize on diameter and make a SS sleeve/housing for the HP seal to press into. The seal presses in the sleeve then the o'ring/seal/sleeve assembly sits in the oversize bore. Theres actually about .010" clearance between the SS sleeve and the bore diameter. I'm hoping this is by design?! There is a chamfer on the OD of the SS sleeve where the O'ring fits and seals against the case. They do bore the valve seats over size and press in SS bushings...The picture of the valve sleeves isn't that great, but you can get the gist. The shiny grey part is the SS bushing/sleeve.

I had another bay that has been noisy for a few years now. Never got any better or worse, so I let it go....I took the Vilco head up today and swapped heads with that bay. It now purrs like a kitten! I might have to take pump maintenance a little more serious! I put in a brand new 310S pump yesterday and the Vilco repaired head today and I can't tell any difference between the two. Time will tell.

 

[MEP001]

The Dynajet repair has a stainless sleeve pressed in permanently. It's the same as buying a new sleeved 310 manifold at less than half the cost.

The Vilco repair seems like it will eventually fail just like the orogonal manifold surface did.

FWIW, the eroded pump you pictured should have been resealed a very long time ago. Maybe your pulleys should be resized - you've been pumping at least a gallon a minute through worn seals for months for it to get like that.

 

[2Biz]

The Dynajet repair has a stainless sleeve pressed in permanently. It's the same as buying a new sleeved 310 manifold at less than half the cost.

The Vilco repair seems like it will eventually fail just like the orogonal manifold surface did.

FWIW, the eroded pump you pictured should have been resealed a very long time ago. Maybe your pulleys should be resized - you've been pumping at least a gallon a minute through worn seals for months for it to get like that.

Not going to argue with that! You would have thought it would have lost pressure, but it didn't. I didn't have to adjust the regulator or anything other than noticing the hose just started rattling in the attic a few weeks ago....The pump itself never made any different noise than it usually did...So without having a crystal ball, what's a mother to do?!

I tried looking up Dynajet and couldn't find any info on their repair. Do you have any links or any other info? What they charge, etc... etc?

 

[2Biz]

Anyone know how much you can safely turn/face off of the Seal Case seating face? I realize making them shorter affects how they hold in the Wick Retainers. Asking for a friend!

 

[MEP001]

That's why I mentioned checking the pulley sizes. If the pump is turning too fast you won't know your seals are bad until it's really bad.

It's $200 plus return freight, they do all ports with sleeves (All three packings and all six valves). I talked to them not long ago and the guy I spoke with said they've never had a failure of their repair. http://www.dynajet.com/default_files/Page334.htm Just send it with a name, return address and phone number, and when it's done they'll call for a credit card for payment. No RMA needed.

 

[MEP001]

Anyone know how much you can safely turn/face off of the Seal Case seating face? I realize making them shorter affects how they hold in the Wick Retainers. Asking for a friend!

You don't want to take off much at all because the plastic seal retainer pieces need to hold the low pressure seal in place. As the seal casing gets shorter you'll have movement of the seal which will make it fail prematurely. I'd recommend replacing them if you have to remove more than a couple thou. If your pumps are so old that it uses a snap ring to retain the low-pressure seals, you can take them down a lot without a problem.